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Collectibles => Past Hasbro 3.75" Lines => Star Wars Rebels => Topic started by: Jesse James on October 12, 2013, 07:12 PM

Title: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Jesse James on October 12, 2013, 07:12 PM
What's your take?  Where do you stand?
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Scockery on October 12, 2013, 07:16 PM
I'm not on the take.

I stand on the ground or preferably a solid surface.

Wait and see...
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: McMetal on October 12, 2013, 10:13 PM
I think the 5 POA sucks, but producing them in a style consistent with how they look on the show is the right way to go IMO. If they mesh well with the Clone Wars aesthetic, so much the better.

I think it remains to be seen what the actual show will be like. Despite ariring on Cartoon Network, Clone Wars had a lot of adult content seemingly aimed at a more mature audience. The last few seasons did not feel much like a kid show. (In a good way, but I could see them lightening things up this time around with less darker overtones)

I expect to like the show as I have enjoyed all the previous Star Wars animated fare. And I do miss collecting Star Wars stuff since the Clone Wars line ended. So I'm probably all in on these guys.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: McMetal on October 13, 2013, 08:23 AM
Looks like I spoke too soon. From Imperial Shipyards' Q&A:

"The "Rebels" toyline will be somewhat stylized in the same design as the animation but will be closer to a "realistic" style than "Clone Wars" style."

So, instead of picking a particular style they just found a way to piss everyone off. WTF does "somewhat stylized" even mean? They'll kind of look like the characters from the show, but not really? No thanks.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Darby on October 13, 2013, 11:26 AM
I think they mean the detail will be soft enough to read as animated but detailed enough to appeal to collectors. 5 POA is not an issue for me, it's all about whether the show/characters are interesting or not.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Jesse James on October 13, 2013, 08:11 PM
That's interesting since JTA was reporting animated style...  Now another sites saying something VERY different?  It's possible perhaps the animation itself is far less stylized and a little more realistic?  TE concepts for that imperial officer didn't look nearly as animated as TCW.  Nor did that inquisitor.

My stance is, depending on their gear and usability, I'm probably in for at least customizing.  $6 makes that a lot easier to stomach.  I may not buy all but some, sure.

I think separation of line looks is a mistake.  I think, in a time when you're trying to include everyone to make the most, that making a line of toys animated looking and going against almost the entire modern line is asking people to pick and choose...  It's tough to want to buy into something that doesn't blend with 90% of what I have.  That said I picked and chooses TCW and will do the same here.

I'm curious to see what the final character animation looks like.  This hybrid style may make aliens and droids fit in far better than they did in TCW line.  Humans may not mesh as well still. :/
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Scockery on October 13, 2013, 11:30 PM
I kinda don't like that they are going with the "black brow line blending into helmet lenses" look for the stormtroopers. It's not technically wrong, but just prefer the white gap, more like a skull, less like sunglasses.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: JediJman on October 14, 2013, 02:31 PM
What is between the CW animated style vs. the more realistic main line style?  Honestly, I thought some of the aliens from the CW series fit right in with main line stuff, so not sure what a hybrid of these two would look like.  I'd prefer they mesh with the rest of the line personally.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Jeff on October 14, 2013, 02:40 PM
What is between the CW animated style vs. the more realistic main line style?  Honestly, I thought some of the aliens from the CW series fit right in with main line stuff, so not sure what a hybrid of these two would look like. 

2008 Clone Wars was a hybrid look.  Some of the later CW wave figures went more "animated" (thinking Anakin/Obi-Wan for sure) and some ended up more "realistic" like some aliens and Cad Bane.  A while back there was a great developement pic that came out.  It really highlighted how some at LFL wanted pure animated, most of Hasbro wanted realistic, and they settled inbetween.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Jesse James on October 14, 2013, 02:46 PM
Yeah that was Anakin and the realistic Ani wound up being their realistic figure test sculpt iirc.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Jeff on October 14, 2013, 02:50 PM
Here was the pic from 2008.  They started off in 2008 with the Hybrid Anakin, but later Clone Wars was closer to 'Animated' Anakin, while TVC Anakin was like the 'Saga' one shown here.

(http://www.rebelscum.com/2008/TCWanakinsculpt.jpg)
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Jeff on October 14, 2013, 02:56 PM
Here's another one from 2008 that basically spells out how the plan was to adjust the figures to create an animated/realistic hybrid design.

(http://www.rebelscum.com/2008/TCWobiwandesign.jpg)
http://www.rebelscum.com/2008/TCWobiwandesign.jpg
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Nicklab on October 14, 2013, 06:12 PM
5 POA seems to be the way the industry is moving in an effort to bring down costs.  That, or go to the 6" scale which seems to have a greater cross-appeal with collectors who hadn't necessarily been into Star Wars.

The figure designs are going to have a tremendous impact on whether or not the 5 POA is a big deal or not.  I know that in the case of the new Saga Legends and Mission Series figures, I've been pleasantly surprised with the quality of the sculpts on those new figures.  The 5 POA is disappointing, but the high quality of the sculpting of those figures has made the limited articulation a little easier to accept.

I get the feeling we'll see a sneak peek of the first wave(s) of the Rebels line at Toy Fair.  Those figures will probably be out right before SDCC, and we'll probably see more of the line at SDCC.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Brian on September 20, 2014, 06:31 PM
Thought this looked like the most "basic" thread for this, just for the general "Rebels" line, but how many of you are jumping in with this line?  Initially, I was taking a wait and see approach - and still am to some extent - just because of the Clone Wars.  I really liked that line, and bought the majority of the basic figures, but now they've ended up in a storage bin just because of lack of display space.  It isn't like I have anything against the toys or the show, I love both, but they still take a bit of a back seat to the movie stuff for me so they've been stashed away for now.

That being said, the more I see about Rebels, the more excited I get.  Not only that, but our daughter is really into the fact that there are major female characters with Hera and Sabine, so I have a feeling that might fuel more casual purchases as well.  Plus the fact the 5 POA stuff is cheaper.  I'm starting to lean more towards jumping into these, or maybe even preordering some.  Anyone else thinking of getting into this line, or just sticking with the show (or maybe neither)?
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: McMetal on September 24, 2014, 11:17 AM
Yeah, I'm all in for sure...the Clone Wars line was the pinnacle of my SW collecting enthusiasm, so the Rebels stuff will help to fill that void. I'd prefer not to have 5POA figures but at the end of the day they're sitting on a shelf anyway so not the end of the world to me.

I'm not really a fan of the cartoony Stormtroopers but the other characters all look great. And the ships look fantastic!

Will be curious to see how long this line (and show for that matter) last.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Dave on September 26, 2014, 11:28 AM
My kids are now 7, 4, and 4 and I'm hoping to get them a little hooked on Star Wars though the new Rebels series.  Clone Wars was way too dark for them so I didn't let them watch it.

I expect to buy all the toys, bust them open, and see if the kids start digging Star Wars. 

I've got hundreds (who are we kidding? thousands) of OT/PT figures and ships in my basement waiting to be opened and played with.  I think my wife will think I'm loony if I I'm playing with toys without the kids...  ::)
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Dave on October 6, 2014, 11:11 AM
Anybody have any idea when the Rebels figures are supposed to start hitting?  It seems a shame that there are no figures (other than the TRU pack) available with the release of this cartoon series.

The kids and I watched the show over the weekend and they loved it.  Too bad I can't easily buy them any toys associated with this.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Jayson on October 6, 2014, 12:18 PM
Anybody have any idea when the Rebels figures are supposed to start hitting?  It seems a shame that there are no figures (other than the TRU pack) available with the release of this cartoon series.

The kids and I watched the show over the weekend and they loved it.  Too bad I can't easily buy them any toys associated with this.

I've heard rumblings of product pushed to Nov.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Jeff on October 6, 2014, 01:03 PM
Yeah, it was a bad sign when many etailers weren't even taking pre-orders on the basic Rebels/Legends figures until last week...  and most of those etailers have a November arrival date now.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: McMetal on October 6, 2014, 01:05 PM
They didn't seem to have a problem getting those ****** rebels Command figures into stores ahead of time.  ::)
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Jayson on October 6, 2014, 01:28 PM
They didn't seem to have a problem getting those ****** rebels Command figures into stores ahead of time.  ::)

Cheap to grind out en masse and more profit per piece. Not that they are selling all that well, at least in my area.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Dave on October 6, 2014, 02:18 PM
I think its a huge miss to mix these in with Legends figures for the "launch", especially considering its going to be some time before these get to retail.

In my opinion they should have had a case of Rebels figures available now, along with the ships, role play, and everything else Rebels.  Maybe after the first wave they could have mixed these in with Legends figures, but I think its going to be tough for your average mom shopping at Target to come up with these figures before Christmas.

I hope they've got battle packs or some other dedicated packs of these coming for the kids for the holiday season.

I had hoped to get my kids a bit hooked on this series and action figures, but by the time the figures come out the novelty of the show will have worn off.  They better have a damn good show to hold kids attention for 2-3 months.

Hasbro missed a great opportunity to kick-start their fan base with a new product line.  And they wonder why Lego is eating their lunch and their revenues are tanking.  ::)
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Jesse James on October 6, 2014, 02:40 PM
They didn't seem to have a problem getting those ****** rebels Command figures into stores ahead of time.  ::)

Cheap to grind out en masse and more profit per piece. Not that they are selling all that well, at least in my area.

+1

They're a different egg, probably made in a completely separate factory.  Action figures take a bit more and a different production process I'd wager.  I wouldn't be shocked if COmmand's produced where vehicles are, actually.  More similar construction aside from the figures.

I was just thinking how "soft" things were for Rebels at retail.  I went to TRU and there was really nothing...  Then again, how much lead time did LFL give to Hasbro to develop any of this?  Figures take time.

I can't imagine Rebels did as well as TCW in terms of ratings either.  TCW had the film to launch it, and there was just a lot going on.  This feels very different.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Jeff on October 6, 2014, 03:47 PM
I can't imagine Rebels did as well as TCW in terms of ratings either.  TCW had the film to launch it, and there was just a lot going on.  This feels very different.

With TCW, it seemed like LFL was looking for "the next big thing" for Star Wars.  With SWR, it seems like Disney is just looking for a bridge to the next big thing - Episode 7. 

Rebels just seems like Disney's way to get kids introduced to OT things - TIE Fighters, Stormtroopers, The Empire, etc.  That's why it won't surprise me if teenage Princess Leia or young Han Solo and Chewbacca end up on this show so kids learn who they are and what "the rebels" are all about to get them primed for Episode 7.  Even a trip where Kanan has to visit Obi-Wan on Tatooine and Ezra "accidentally" runs into 13-yr old Luke on an adventure wouldn't surprise me.

Yeah, I agree that Hasbro/Disney are missing the boat by not having a bunch of stuff ready for Rebels launch... but I always kinda got the sense that Disney/Hasbro was happy to miss this boat (putting Rebels figures in with Legends figures...  again seeding the kids with OT stuff) while they construct the SUPER-MEGA-ULTRA-SHIP they will be launching this time next year. :P
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: P-Siddy on October 7, 2014, 12:52 AM
... Ezra "accidentally" runs into 13-yr old Luke on an adventure wouldn't surprise me.

Kind of like the Phineas and Ferb: Star Wars episode.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Phrubruh on October 7, 2014, 09:27 AM
Didn't we already kind of see Chewie and Lumpy in the SWR "movie"?
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Jesse James on October 7, 2014, 02:01 PM
I REALLY don't want those cameos...  Leia, at most, would be ok I guess.  Perhaps some mild interaction with OWK, but Luke?  No.  Han?  No.  No No No No NO!

I just don't want any of that crappola going on.

Some Bounty Hunters would be ok to me too I suppose, but I don't need to see a young Lando showing up or anything. 

Which means all that probably will happen.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Dave on October 7, 2014, 03:47 PM
Didn't we already kind of see Chewie and Lumpy in the SWR "movie"?

According to Wookieepedia the parent/child Wookiees were Wullffwarro and Kitwarr.

My four year old son asked me if that was Chewbacca and I had to go look it up.  I had assumed if it was Chewbacca they would have made it clear.  Plus Chewie was supposed to have been rescued by Han, but I guess he could be caught and rescued multiple times.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Phrubruh on October 7, 2014, 04:27 PM
Damn. I was hoping it was Lumpy. I was cheering for the stormtrooper during that scene. I was half expecting the stormtrooper to shoot Kitwarr in the back or at least stun him but i guess that would have been a little dark for a kids show. I mean what is the stormtrooper going to do when he catches the wookiee? Carry him back over his sholder? It's like chasing a small bear cub.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Jesse James on October 7, 2014, 07:11 PM
They were both referenced by name in the show IIRC?  I know Kitwarr was.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Dave on November 10, 2014, 04:23 PM
Are either Sabine or Hera scheduled to be released as figures anytime soon, either as individually carded figures or as pack-ins?

My daughter is getting in to the show with me and the boys but wants to play with some of the girl characters.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Nicklab on November 10, 2014, 06:58 PM
Sabine and Hera both come as part of the Mission Series 2-packs.  And each of them is packed with a Stormtrooper.  Sabine and a Stormtrooper are in Mission Series wave 5.  Hera and the Stormtrooper with pauldron are probably in the following wave, but I haven't seen any retail solicitation for that wave yet.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Dave on November 11, 2014, 09:21 AM
Sabine and Hera both come as part of the Mission Series 2-packs.  And each of them is packed with a Stormtrooper.  Sabine and a Stormtrooper are in Mission Series wave 5.  Hera and the Stormtrooper with pauldron are probably in the following wave, but I haven't seen any retail solicitation for that wave yet.

Thanks. 

That is actually a really smart way to pack these figures in if Hasbro believes they can't sell a female figure.  Pack them with Stormtroopers for $10 and you should get more takers.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: McMetal on November 11, 2014, 11:27 AM
Sabine really needs a removable helmet version. She hardly ever even wears that damn thing on the show.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Jesse James on November 11, 2014, 02:13 PM
Did it with Ezra, so it's kind of confusing not to do it with Sabine, but I'm guessing it's her hair, the animation style, and the shrinking of her head they'd have to do (or enlarging of the helmet) not looking right, which is keeping them from giving her a removable helmet.  Just my guess right now.  I'd not be shocked to see a helmetless version at some point.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels Saga Legends Figures
Post by: Nicklab on February 18, 2015, 10:05 AM
Has anyone else seen this article?  EW:  Hasbro thinks 'Star Wars Rebels' has 'plenty' of female figures. No (http://community.ew.com/2015/02/17/hasbro-star-wars-female-characters/)

So... when did Entertainment Weekly get themselves into the business of discussing the Star Wars Action Figure business?  I know who the contributor is who wrote this piece.  She blogs and works (or has worked) for EE.  But has she noticed that there are only TWO female main characters in the show??!?!  And that Sabine only just started shipping within the past few weeks, with Hera on the way, very soon as well?
Title: Re: Re: Star Wars Rebels Saga Legends Figures
Post by: P-Siddy on February 18, 2015, 10:18 AM
Has anyone else seen this article?  EW:  Hasbro thinks 'Star Wars Rebels' has 'plenty' of female figures. No (http://community.ew.com/2015/02/17/hasbro-star-wars-female-characters/)

I think JTA asked a similar question at TF and that was the response they got.
Title: Re: Re: Star Wars Rebels Saga Legends Figures
Post by: Jeff on February 18, 2015, 10:21 AM
Steve, that article is about the Q&A at JTA. 


The EW piece explains why Hasbro asked Paul/JTA to change their answer...  the JTA Q&A now reads:

Quote
Q: Where are the action figures for the female characters from Rebels, like Hera, Sabine, or Maketh Tua? Male characters like Ezra and Kanan have been released multiple times already in many formats and scales, yet the best we've seen on shelves so far is a single Sabine with a non-removable helmet and a yet-to-be-released Hera, both of whom are packed with re-released Stormtroopers. Female characters have always played an integral role in the Star Wars saga, from Leia in the original trilogy to Padme in the prequels to Ahsoka and Asaaj in The Clone Wars and have always been among the first characters released in figure form, yet for this new chapter in the Saga, they've barely been a blip on the radar.

A: Hasbro actually has some great new characters from Rebels hitting shelves now such as Sabine and Hera and have recently been releasing more females within our Black Series and Saga Legends line such as Mara Jade, Toryn Farr, Bastila Shan, Luminara Unduli, Padma Amidala (Geonosis), and a number of great Leia’s such as Ep IV, Endor, and the awesome Boushh disguise that was revealed at NYCC. (Editor's Note: Hasbro has asked to have this answer revised.)
Title: Re: Re: Star Wars Rebels Saga Legends Figures
Post by: P-Siddy on February 18, 2015, 10:27 AM
Steve, that article is about the Q&A at JTA. 


I see that... interesting.  So, misquoting or damage control?
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels Saga Legends Figures
Post by: Dave on February 18, 2015, 10:30 AM
Clearly nobody at Hasbro has a five year old daughter who watches Rebels and tries to buy figures at retail.   >:(

I get it that you don't want to pack a Mon Mothma in every case, but not having two of the main characters (and the only females) available for many months after the line launches is pathetic.

There are essentially nine main characters (counting a Stormtrooper as a main character).  They made seven in the first wave of Rebels and Mission Series.  Pretty sad the two they left out were the only female characters.

We're going on four months since the line launched and I'm guessing we're still a couple of months away from being able to get our hands on Hera.  A few have managed to just get Sabine, but I can't imagine your average soccer mom looking for toys for her kids at Target is going to stumble on a Sabine any time soon.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Nicklab on February 18, 2015, 11:02 AM
I get the frustration over Hera and Sabine getting delayed.  But what about the other 2 main characters from the Ghost's crew?  In the 3.75" action figure line there has been ONE version of Zeb and ONE version of Chopper.  I got my Sabine last week and STILL have not found Chopper.  Talking about "So many Kanans and so many Ezras" is all well and good.  But neglecting to mention that characters like Zeb and Chopper in the context of this conversation, both of whom are on pretty equal footing in the show with Hera and Sabine, is a significant omission.  And you know what?  This whole conversation might have been averted if Hasbro had just offered the Mission Series set with Hera and the Stormtrooper Commander in place of the set with Zeb and the Stormtrooper.

And truth be told?  Both Ezra and Kanan are the main characters of this story.  As such I expect Hasbro to focus primarly on them.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Jeff on February 18, 2015, 12:00 PM
I agree, Nick.  Chopper is still hard to find for a lot of people.  And if they had flipped Hera and Zeb, there'd be people upset about not getting Zeb yet.

Maybe Hasbro could have saved themselves the headache and done a single wave of mission series packs = Hera/Kanan, Ezra/Sabine, Zeb/Chopper, Inquisitor/Stormtrooper, Kallus/AT-DP Driver and then just called it a day with the Rebels line... :P
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Scockery on February 18, 2015, 02:18 PM
I'd say it's a fair bet that what's been released and seen previewed is all there is to the Rebels toy line. Or at least until next year.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Darby on February 18, 2015, 03:51 PM
I imagine there's a bit of damage control in Hasbro's revised statement. It was a glib answer to a somewhat glib question. In fairness to Hasbro, the SW line has been historically representative of female characters. Especially in contrast to other traditionally boy centric toy lines. Absolutely there's a valid critique in the number of female characters in SW in general, but that's a problem at the source of the material. The 'late' releases of Sabine and Hera is a fair question but it's clear this isn't a case where Hasbro suddenly remembered to do them. They were in the cards from the start and if not for some of the distribution issues I think we might have seen them in stores sooner. In any case we're due to see them both here together fast.

This next bit goes to my comments in the Toy Fair thread about reactions to the show in general. Since the JTA Q&A was referenced in the blog post specifically, it's fair to mention that some of what concerned me originated there. Paul by his own admission in the comments mentioned the rapid-fire nature of his interview, which was stressful for him (it doesn't need to be! This is supposed to be fun!) yielded little info and cranky responses from a Hasbro rep who I felt clearly bristled at a long, long line of negative questioning. As I said before, the basic tenor of some comments I've seen - not just about Toy Fair and absolutely not just from the commenters on JTA - goes like this: I can't stand Hasbro, everything Hasbro is doing is wrong, but what is Hasbro doing next?

The SSG Q&A stands in stark contrast. Here's a fairly positive interview that still asks some tough questions and yielded what is probably the only real news out of Toy Fair - the possibility we may see the Ghost. After I shot down the idea of it like five minutes before I saw the Q&A, I'm pretty convinced now we'll see it. The nature of the discussion on the Ghost Steve had with Jeff Labovitz is basically the same as when Daryl DePriest 'confirmed' the MTT to me at NYCC 2011. I was glad to see in the JTA comments that Paul is thinking he won't go with reader questions in the future. Not because reader questions aren't important, but because there didn't seem to be a great deal of filtering. There were numerous questions he didn't relay to Hasbro and for very good reason. I enjoy my hobby. I'm tired of the negativity and the shade throwing and snark. Collectors in general should all have the enthusiasm people like Paul Harrison has for our hobby. Be passionate. Don't be hateful though. If you don't like it, don't buy it. They'll figure it out quick and if they don't, then someone else someday will get a shot at it. They're toys. Have fun!
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Muftak on February 18, 2015, 04:17 PM
Here here, Darby. Good points all around.

I'm not much of a presence around here anymore because there are, like 8 figures left that I want Hasbro to make to finish my collection and I'll be done. I pop in to see if they're coming, but the rest of what's going on really doesn't concern me anymore. My 5-year old son loves watching Rebels with me, though, and has started buying the Rebels figures, so these days I am advocating for him, filtered through my own experiences with this hobby. :) I had my fun, now it's his turn, and I feel I am in a good position to guide him on his journey.

My son was looking at my figures and when I told him they made ones of the Rebels characters now, he wanted to get some to play with. He went to the store with Christmas money and we found that all that were available were the Zeb/Stormie 2-pack, Artoo and Threepio, and the Kanan/Ezra/Obi-Wan pack at TRU. None of the places we have been have had any of the single figures, and I suspect we nearly missed the Sabine/Stormie 2-pack (we saw Wicket and the Scout Trooper on the pegs.) Since then we have looked for more to no avail. We have also found no Rebels vehicles on the shelves...he is a big walker fan and wants one of those as well as the Phantom.

Last week he caved and bought a Bespin Luke/Darth Vader 2-pack just to add some more characters to his toybox (and he was excited about a pack with two lightsabers for instant dueling possibilities.) Routinely his figures play in and around my BMF which I get down for him and he uses it to substitute for the Ghost.

His favorite characters on the show are Chopper and Sabine, and he has been sad that he hasn't been able to find them yet. I promised him they're coming, as are the Inquisitor and other bad guys. I am happy with what we have been shown as in the pipeline, and I have to hold out hope that this stuff will show up somewhere soon in quantities that will allow him to get what he wants. I would be crushed for him if he missed his only chance at getting a Chopper or Inquisitor at the store last year.

I love that Sabine, Zeb and Hera all come with Stormtroopers. I wish there was an option to get Chopper, Kanan and Ezra that way, too, so he could build up a squad to fight. He is having fun dipping his toe into collecting figures, and so far the frustration of not being able to find what he wants hasn't stopped him since it is so early for him. Time will tell if things work out well for his collection. I feel so blessed to have a young Star Wars fan in the family.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Jesse James on February 18, 2015, 04:26 PM
I think some of the wave breakdowns also falls into the realm where they're balancing waves financially...  Solid wave of all new is tough to do.  Rebels seemed like they were trying to phase it in with the existing MS and Legends stuff.

To be fair, I've not seen a Kanan, Ezra, Chopper, or Hera (is she out?) at all.  I have seen Zeb's set, and I saw Sabine at Target once.

I see both sides of the argument...  I didn't know what the first answer was, but seeing the second answer, I kind of see why Hasbro feels they've done well in the last year or two.  There are some pretty good female characters on their rundown, we're getting two Leia's, same costume, different scales soon...  Slave Leia's a top-demand figure, an outfit that's transcended into pop culture (for better or worse), and one of her more empowered outfits since she kills the dude that put her in it.  I dunno.

I think right now there aren't male characters to buy, nor female, haha.  I wanted Chopper, but if I don't get him that's ok.  But I also have never seen a sniff of him or the wave he was in, so I may have to deal without.

I think I'd be more annoyed with Disney, who I think made Hera and Sabine as kind of an answer to this outrage over lacking female characters in Star Wars, but I also feel they could've (and perhaps should've) gone the extra mile making either Kanan female, or Ezra, but not both of them human white males.  I'd have dug seeing Kanan a woman, and Ezra and her having a perhaps rough relationship because of that?  "Judge me by my gender, do you?"

Maybe cliche or something, but I'd find it a more interesting relationship dynamic I guess, than just the dudes going off and being forcey.

Anyway, off track there...

I'm not sure what to make of the question or answer really.  Was it a direct quote, or paraphrased?  If it was paraphrased, what was the exact direct quote then, assuming there's audio or whatever of it?  Without all that info it's kinda tough to say whether it was misquoting by one party or backpedaling by the other party, right?

It also is a weird situation at Toy Fair where people are really essentially fighting for time to talk to Hasbro reps amongst each other, especially when it's busier (not that it was this year).  And of course it's not something that's as private and controlled as SDCC is, so the answers can come a little on the quicker side.  What may seem dismissive was maybe not intended, but still came off that way because Q's and A's are getting rattled off fast.

I'd like to know more, really, about the question and the answer, verbatim, at least.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: JediJman on February 18, 2015, 04:29 PM
Okay, but the fact is that they did release Chopper and Zeb with the female figures still coming in a later wave.  While all of these have been hard to find, some people actually have Zeb and Chopper.  Pretty much no one has Hera and Sabine, who are at least equal-time cast members.  It's convenient to say that they have other female figures or they could have done this or that, but there is clearly a pattern of hesitation or bias when it comes to female figures.  When they are produced, they're usually in later waves and in limited numbers (per case) versus other characters.  Multiple versions of Ahsoka are among the hardest figures to find from their respective lines.  Flip over to other toylines like DC or Marvel. There are no females I'm aware of in the current DC 4" line.  The hardest figure to find from Marvel 4" Infinites?  The Wasp.  I see lots of Spiderman and Captain America Legends figures collecting dust, but there's virtually no sign of Spiderwoman, Black Cat, or Black Widow.  Even in the Guardians line, Gamora is among the hardest to find. 

Its just frustrating that after decades of selling figures, Hasbro and their ilk can't come to terms with anyone buying their product outside of 7-12 year old boys.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Darby on February 18, 2015, 04:37 PM
To Jesse's point, I'd be very curious to on the exact nature of Hasbro's original comment given the storm brewing over this now. Was the original response paraphrased? Out of context? Did Hasbro really blow off the question and are now back peddling? Are the people making hay over this conscious of what has and hasn't happened in the brand relative to female figures in even the last 2 years? Or what's about to happen? Numerous Leia's are coming here in just the next few months. I've always been a huge proponent of female characters and their representations in toys, but this whole argument needs some perspective.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Jesse James on February 18, 2015, 04:51 PM
Hasbro has outright said in the past female characters don't sell as well as male characters, for what that's worth.  Sort of surprised that statement's not come up in all this debate actually.

I know Torryn Farr was one of the most short-packed TBS figures, but is one of the worse sellers...  That could be a sign though that collectors themselves aren't as into the hobby too.  Even a reseller nearby with a store in the mall has her on sale, haha.

Personally I can only own 2 Rebels figures (Stormtrooper aside) total.  I have only ever seen Sabine and Zeb, and I can get Zeb right now I know.  Sabine I'm not sure what Target's stock is like.

I've not seen any other figure from the series, personally.

If Hasbro's #'s say female characters don't sell as well, should they still make more of them anyway?  Is there justification there for them to not make as many or are they just not doing something right with the female figures on their end and they would sell well if not for their own mistakes?  I dunno.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Qui-Gon Jim on February 18, 2015, 05:18 PM
Additionally, even 6" Greedo calls 6" Leia a peg warmer.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: McMetal on February 18, 2015, 05:19 PM
Great discussion, and certainly a few topics here of particular interest to me.

First, to the "Q&A". I'm glad someone referenced the SSG vs JTA chats, because to me they could not have been more different. SSG asked some good questions, got some good answers (yay, Ghost!) and did not inject any sort of editorializing or personal complaints in their write-up. (Such as "too many other people at those darn other sites kept interrupting me!" or "I'm not asking all these negative questions that I solicited on my own site and wrote down and brought with me anyway for some inexplicable reason!")

Maybe the overall tenor of the questions is a reflection of the personality/maturity level of the fan base they have cultivated to this point. Maybe all those front page articles about the line's impending doom and OMG WTF are you doing now, Hasbro?!?! have had a trickledown effect on the people that read that stuff regularly, so that they cannot help but frame everything in a critical and frightening light?

It's nice to want to interact with the site members in some way, but maybe Paul should just come up with his own questions from now on. Or solicit some from other sites...I'm sure JD could have provided him with a few quality ones. I don't think that kind of snarkiness is necessarily representative of the collector community in general.

As far as the topic of female action figures, this has always been a sore issue for me. I have two young daughters, and I don't want their gateway into the world of action figures to be some humiliated woman in a metal bikini. So no thanks Hasbro. Hera and Sabine scream "Girl Power". Yeah, we got them as figures, but only in two packs, not single carded, and only after the primary male figures had long been out. The message sure seems to be "we don't think we can possibly sell these losers on their own". And they couldn't even put out Sabine with a removable helmet, which they did with Ezra. I guess they figure if they disguise her maybe noone will realize she's a girl. And to date there have been NO female characters made in the larger scales such as 12" or 20" or even 31". (Again, we got Ezra, Kanan, and even Kallus who is a more minor character than Hera OR Sabine)

I do recall them saying that female figures don't sell as well as male figures, but I think it really depends on the character choices. Season 3 Ahsoka in the CW line for example, was an oustanding seller. And yes, I'm still bitter about not getting Duchess Satine or Bo-Katan in the animated line despite them having major roles. Maybe Hasbro just needs to work on figuring out how to market more effectively to that segment of their audience.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: JediJman on February 18, 2015, 05:48 PM
Hasbro has outright said in the past female characters don't sell as well as male characters, for what that's worth.  Sort of surprised that statement's not come up in all this debate actually.

Hasbro stating something doesn't make it true.  I'm not at all inclined to believe that statement, especially when they post-edit Q&A responses to save face.  What's the last female figure you recall pegwarming?  Legacy Yarna? 

Look, I certainly don't have visibility to the entirety of retail, but I don't know how you can consistently find a full line of Avengers or Captain America or Spiderman sitting on shelves with nothing missing except the female figures, then turn around and say they don't sell well.  The analyst stating that probably compared female figure sales to male figure sales and said, "oh yeah, these 15 male figures way outsold this 1 female figure, so female figures must not sell well." 

I don't want to be just another Hasbro-hater in the midst of a hobby I still really enjoy, but I can't help feeling exhausted at their BS responses and just continued incompetence in so many aspects of running these lines from females to assortment to distribution to pricing to the damn packaging falling apart in my hands.  It really is a testament to the franchise that anyone still buys what little they see fit to produce.  I can't think of another product line where consumers would be so forgiving. 

Rant over.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Darby on February 18, 2015, 06:57 PM
+1 on seeing Bo-Katan and Sabine someday. Everything is eventual with this line, so hope springs eternal. So many CW figures left to do. But I digress.

Great points all around. Nobody looks good in this. Not the question, the answer, the revision, or the pot-stirring afterwards. To the last point - even in the SSG Q&A there was some corporate speak and non-answers. On the question of why Hera or Sabine are paired with troopers, and not single carded, the answer was 'it could have been anybody paired with a trooper.' But it wasn't. Fair enough - we got Zeb with a trooper. But you paired them up deliberately because of your (Hasbro's) self-stated belief female figures don't sell. I personally don't mind getting another trooper along with them, and love the concept of them pairing figures with troops like this, but with these two figures, you did it to insulate yourself against potential peg warmers. Fair enough. Just be upfront about it.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Jesse James on February 18, 2015, 09:56 PM
McMetal,

I think you've got an interesting perspective since you've got daughters, you're wanting to share fandom with them, and collecting...  I respect that.

I think Hasbro's stance on the whole male figs/female figs sales is really just a numbers game, with a buttload of factors that go into it that nobody but themselves are privy to, and it spans all these years I'm sure.  Is it true?  I don't know.  I assume since they stated it, there's some numbers that back it up.  I mean, women aren't the dominant force in action figure buying, but they're a growing segment I think.  Is Hasbro, as a company, trying to adjust to the trend?

I'd say Rebels is just hard to gauge this topic by because Rebels is so new and obviously grossly unrepresented, to where nobody's easy to get (my personal experience) aside from Zeb.  No clue why they didn't do Sabine with a removable helmet and Ezra with one.  Maybe they want to sell two figures?  Maybe they hate women?  Maybe they couldn't cost the extra gear in for some reason?  Maybe it's Ezra's smaller size allowed the helmet accessory?  Again, no clue.

BTW I agree on Ahsoka ultimately...  I think they dropped the ball there.  She was (is) popular, she got a few figures, but none were ever easily available for one reason or another it seemed.  I still want a young Ahsoka done realistically. :(

Jman,

Since I have no details on how much they post-edited a comment, and how much the comment may have been paraphrased, I'm unwilling to say Hasbro is a villain in this situation, or just misunderstood, or (a worst case scenario) misrepresented.  There's no context to go by to make the assumption, but it sucks if they really just backpedaled to save face.  To me it's neither here nor there really without the context, the full quote, etc.

That said, the last figure I saw pegwarming that was a woman?  Torryn Farr and Luminara Undulli both come to mind immediately, 6" Leia as well...  I remember quite a few over the years.  So yeah, it happens and it's a tad disingenuous to insinuate female figures just fly off the pegs, haha.

Then again I've seen an army of Ree Yees at TRU, and 6" Han Solo figures, Greedos, and OWK, lots of 4" Hoth Luke, 6" Speederbike sets...  So I think the reality is anything can pegwarm.  The question is do female figures pegwarm faster?  How does Hasbro gauge this stuff?  I don't know really, beyond sales data they've cited (but won't show) that claims this...  Which all may be a lie.

As I have said before, I am sure any sales info is something Hasbro has and we don't, so it is what it is.  Ultimately you either believe it or you don't...  Not much argument to be made from either side on that though.  I don't think their data applies across the board that ALL female figures sell poorly.  I think some do.  Then again so do a lot of male figures.  I'm sure there's data available to them on that as well.  And aliens, and so on.  And what Hasbro says, you either believe or not...  Not much argument against either POV I guess, since it's simply a matter of what you believe is reality or not.

Going back to the point about getting the entire crew out quickly, and regarding Hera and Sabine, specifically, I think Hasbro would've been wise to get the entire crew of The Ghost out at the same time, like Jeff said maybe in all 2-packs or something, then sprinkle singles in down the road...  No reason not to I can see, if you want the cartoon to have support all around.  They really needed to have EVERYONE from the show's main cast out there immediately.  Even the villains can be sprinkled in later and kids will generally not notice, or maybe they'd even be more excited to finally get the bad guy when he finally comes out.

I didn't mind everyone having a stormtrooper as a pack-in though.  I think that'd be neat, actually, since it'd help kids amass squads for their Rebels to destroy.  I liked that concept.  I wish they'd carried it over with every main hero having a stormtrooper, actually.  It'd help spread costs around over the stormie's mold tooling too.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Jeff on February 18, 2015, 10:10 PM
I do recall them saying that female figures don't sell as well as male figures, but I think it really depends on the character choices. Season 3 Ahsoka in the CW line for example, was an oustanding seller.

BTW I agree on Ahsoka ultimately...  I think they dropped the ball there.  She was (is) popular, she got a few figures, but none were ever easily available for one reason or another it seemed.  I still want a young Ahsoka done realistically. :(

I agree that character choice is the ultimate factor in who will sell, male or female.

Star of popular EU books (Mara Jade), star of a video game (Bastilla Shan), star of a popular cartoon (Ahsoka)?  You'll sell. 
Star of Echo base's radio staion (Toryn), star of Jabba's fat dancers (Yarna), star of holding baby Leia (Breha), star of the Jedi Library (Jocasta)?  Peg-warmer.

You could say the same about the male figures.  There have been plenty of stinkers on the male side as well thanks to their boring status...

I could see Bo-Katan doing well if she had hit when the show was on since she actually did stuff.  Satine though, don't recall much ACTION there, just moping with Obi-Wan unless I'm mis-remembering.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Nicklab on February 19, 2015, 07:15 AM
Overall, I find it REALLY funny that this whole affair was the result of the nonsensical way that things are running over at JTA these days.  Hasbro's response to that particular question was certainly glib, but JTA should have pressed for more than a yes or no response.  As for the slew of ridiculous questions from the sites readers?  Well, it's the result of this mindset over there that all ideas/questions/comments are equal.  If you're running a collecting site and are interacting with a Star Wars licensee, it's incumbent on that news outlet to act like the adults in the room.  And from what I've seen since my departure there is no sense of sound editorial judgement at work, and little effort to weed out questions from the JTA readership that are pointless, unrealistic or perhaps even insulting to the people at Hasbro.  Personally, I'm very glad that I left the site because my own philosophy about running a site was in contradiction with Paul Mancil's (not his pen name of Harrison) ethos of entertaining the whiny contingent of fandom in an effort to drum up traffic.  I've conducted this Hasbro Toy Fair Q&A for JTA in the past.  And had I done so again this year it would have yielded actual news instead of just stirring up ****.

As for the whole female characters issue?  The long standing trend in the action figure business has been that female characters do not sell as well as their male counterparts.  Hasbro has confirmed that in the past, and like Jesse said, Hasbro has the sales figures but will not release them.  They never will, and consistently cite trade secrets as the reason why.  I'm sure if you checked with other manufacturers you could probably find comparable stats.... provided that they would release similar data.  But they won't.

Does it come down to character selection?  That's probably a major part of the equation.  Ahsoka sold VERY well in pretty much every offering:  the initial TCW figure was popular, the second version with the two lightsabers was one of the most HTF figures in the CW figure line, and the TVC version is pretty sought after, too.  But was she the exception to the rule?  Looking at The Black Series of 3.75" figures, female characters made up about 20% of that basic figure line.  The TBS Padme figure seem to have sold through reasonably well.  As did Mara Jade and Bastila.  But Luminara?  She sold pretty slowly, despite being a Jedi.  And Toryn Farr lingered the longest out of her wave.  So this could come down more to character selection.

As for the REBELS figures?  I maintain the fact that Kanan and Ezra are the central protagonists in the show.  You could even go so far to say that Ezra is the protagonist, with Kanan in the role of spirit guide, much like Obi-Wan Kenobi was a guide to Luke in ANH.  Agent Kallus and the Inquisitor are the chief antagonists. That means that those 4 characters have greater importance in the scope of the story than anyone else.  Zeb, Hera, Sabine and Chopper?  They're interesting, but they're also all supporting characters.  Hasbro, Lucasfilm Animation and Lucasfilm Licensing all know this.  And that's what steers their choices in terms of filling out the action figure line.

So then the question is how do you roll out those supporting characters in the action figure line?  If you approach this from the standpoint of sales demographics for a boys toy line, you're probably going to find that characters like Chopper and Zeb have greater appeal with the core audience for this toy line.  And I don't mean to demean girls who are into the REBELS show.  My daughter has watched the show with me a little bit.  She actually likes Chopper, truth be told.  Do I want positive depictions of female characters in Star Wars for her to enjoy?  Sure.  And I think characters like Sabine and Hera do that for her.  Is she into the toys?  No, not at her age.  Be that as it may, if you look at this from a sales perspective like Hasbro has, I think they're trying to put the potential best sellers out there first.  I think this backlash has caught Hasbro somewhat by surprise, and perhaps they'll change their thought process on this going forward.  Case in point, the Target exclusive version of the Phantom.  That might have been a good way to get Hera out there instead of Kanan.  It would have made sense and I would have sought out that version of the ship myself.
Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: JediJman on February 19, 2015, 11:29 AM
I don't think anyone's arguing that Ezra and Kanan are not the focus of the show or even "more important" characters than the other figures.  But do we need 4 ways to buy those characters? 

3-4 opportunities to buy:
Ezra - Legends Single Carded, TRU 3-pack, Mission Series (Cadet) with Kanan
Kanan - Legends Single Carded, Phantom Pack-in, TRU 3-pack, Mission Series with Ezra
Stormtrooper - Legends Single Carded, Mission Series w/ Zeb, Mission Series with Hera, Mission Series with Sabine

2 opportunity to buy:
Inquisitor - Legends Single Carded, TIE Pack-in

1 opportunity to buy:
Agent Kallus - Legends Single Carded
Chopper - Legends Single Carded
Zeb - Mission Series
Sabine - Mission Series
Hera - Mission Series

There's a cast of essentially only 9 characters, but it's nearly impossible to find over half of them, while the other half are available in three or four different ways!  And that's not even counting the larger sized offerings.  You don't need sales data to point out that this is a missed opportunity for Hasbro and their buyers.

As for the female figures, I'm just so tired of that canned response to them not selling well.  As if boys couldn't possible play with a female character or the characters don't have any appeal to girls.  You can spin the data any way you like, but what we see in the aisles is fact, not opinion.  I'd be willing to put money down that Hasbro doesn't have anything concrete to support this - someone just came up with the excuse at some point and it became a sacred cow.  Just in our little group, the only female examples being brought up are bit characters like Toryn Farr who had half a second of screen time.  Core female characters like Sabine and Hera would sell just as well as the rest of the line, especially in a lineup of under a dozen characters.  Just sad that the people managing this line can't seem to get in touch with reality.

Title: Re: Star Wars Rebels - 5 POA Animated Style Figs
Post by: Dave on February 19, 2015, 03:38 PM
The biggest logic flaw is that if this is a boys line and only male figures sell, then why would you even have main characters be female in the cartoon?  Disney/Lucasfilm can create whatever characters they want. 

I assume the mission of Rebels is prime audiences for TFA, and appeal to younger kids (boys only?) that will bug their parents to buy them stuff.

So they get my 5-year old daughter all excited about the program, all excited about Sabine, and "release" (not really available) her well after the Christmas surge. 

Sabine could have just as easily been a male character, or some androgynous alien, or a droid.  But they chose to make her a young woman / old teenager, I assume to appeal to young girls and pull them in to the story and collecting.

If that is the case, make and release the damn figure straight out of the gates.  Capitalize on your plan to pull in young girls.  It also kills me I have to buy a Sabine t-shirt from Her Universe because Disney and others don't make one.

To me there is a lot of shared ownership on these oversights.  Hasbro has missed the boat, and Lucasfilm/Disney licensing has missed the boat.  I'm sure Disney could have strongly encouraged Hasbro to have Sabine (or Hera) be available at launch.  Maybe they were too busy figuring out what new color of whiny fairy they could add to their Tinkerbell portfolio... ::)