Author Topic: Your Loyalty?  (Read 2947 times)

Offline Darth Broem

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Re: YOUR LOYALTY?
« Reply #15 on: April 4, 2007, 07:55 PM »
I'd like to see Zizzle snatch up the license in 2018 if Hasbro dosen't re-snatch it up.

Do you guys honestly think that you'll be collecting SW toys in 10 more years??  Hasbro cranks out hundreds of figures per year and I'm pretty sure that they will have covered all the bases by then.  I'm already on overload from the stuff I have and I can't even fathom how much more stuff I'll have by 2018.

So if another toy company takes over the license - are some of you guys really thinking about starting all over again - from ground Zero??

 I have an interest in almost anything with a Star Wars label on it.  I can't buy it all obviously but I would undoubtedly have interest and most likely buy it unless it was pure crap of course.  Even then you never know :)  I have bought some crappy SW stuff in the past. 

Offline David

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Re: YOUR LOYALTY?
« Reply #16 on: April 4, 2007, 08:09 PM »
You know, Hasbro really isn't as awful as we give it credit for. Here's a dozen reasons to stay with Hasbro:

TSC Death Star Gunner
TSC Sun Fac
SA Clone Trooper (AOTC)
SA Clone Trooper (ROTS)
TAC Mustafar Lava Miner
'Capture of Tantive IV' Battlepack
VOTC Chewbacca
TSC Gragra
ROTS Ki-Adi Mundi
ROTS Mustafar Sentry
ROTS Luminara Unduli
and the upcoming Jawa w/LIN Droid.

HOWEVER, there is 1999-2003...  :P

I actually think the only thing Zizzle is good for are likenesses and detail. Sure, it'd be great to get an ANH Leia or a Mace Windu out of them, that would be very interesting, but as for sculpt and articulation, they are severely lacking. But, to my knowledge they are still a young(er) toy company, so there is room for improvement.

Hasbro has given us some great stuff, and I think that you cannot have Star Wars collecting without Hasbro because it just wouldn't be the same. 2004 was decent, 2005 was excellent, 2006 had its great moments (VTSC Biker Scout for starters), and 2007 looks better than any year ever. Hasbro does a good job ninety percent of the time. The only problem is in the ten percent they mess up in...they MESS UP BIGTIME, so much that people remember that even through the good times.

In short, I am a Star Wars fan that thinks Hasbro is doing a great job in producing an outlet for my fandom.

 8)
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Offline Greg

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Re: YOUR LOYALTY?
« Reply #17 on: April 4, 2007, 09:01 PM »
My loyalty is to Star Wars. If Hasbro chooses not to renew the license, then I would do one or more of the following:

-Continue collecting a new line of 3 3/4 inch figures if they are produced by a good company (Zizzle may be able to do a good job with Star Wars)

-Back track and buy items made from 1995 up until the Revenge of the Sith line. I wouldn't buy all items, just the stuff Hasbro hasn't remade between 2005 and 2018. 

-Track down Wizards of the Coast miniature figures and ships. Those little guys have always intrigued me for some reason, but they are kind of expensive.

-Buy Lego Star Wars items. I am really tempted by the recent offering from Lego (Battle Packs, upcoming MTT and Hoth Base) but have been holding off on them for now.

-Stop collecting altogether if I am happy with my collection by 2018. Maybe I will attempt to get MOC/MIP versions of all of my loose items. 

Offline Diddly

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Re: YOUR LOYALTY?
« Reply #18 on: April 4, 2007, 09:10 PM »
I probably wouldn't continue. We all bitch and complain about Hasbro, but they DO give is stuff that we want. I'm not sure if I could start over with a new line, because I know the new figures would be different somehow (either in scale, quality, paint, etc.). I hate it when figures are mismatched like that. I'd probably just focus on Legos.

Offline ddschneider1972

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Re: Your Loyalty?
« Reply #19 on: April 4, 2007, 09:40 PM »
I collect Star Wars figures that happen to be made by Hasbro. I have no loyalty to Hasbro at all. They haven't done anything for me that wasn't primarily in their own best interest. If some one else took over the line I'd stay at the same level I am at now, I'd buy new characters and consider anything that is a vast improvement. If anything Hasbro's made me buy less. I started MOC, then loose, then just loose new sculpts,  now just new characters and any vast improvements. They're repacking and repainting and minor tweaking has soured me and many others in recent years...Kenner put out the same Vader figure for 8 years. I have at least 30 different Hasbro Vaders. What makes it worth it is the "gold" they can churn out, like an Ephant Mon  or the Evolutions.   
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Offline Morgbug

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Re: Your Loyalty?
« Reply #20 on: April 4, 2007, 09:55 PM »
I confess to feeling little loyalty to Hasbro.

Partly it's their fault, partly not.  The not part is just a general dismay and frustration at having so little on display since moving.  Why the hell am I parting with good money for stuff to go into storage?  It's a question I ask every day.

The part that is their fault is partly due to Hasbro Canada and partly due to Hasbro in general.  The Canadian side can't be entirely blamed on the parent corporation, but the shitass distribution in Canada is frustrating beyond belief.  Yes, it's a small market relative to the US, but adjust your business accordingly, you've been at it long enough.

Each sub-line of the modern era has seen us screwed out of the distribution system:
POTF2 - no last freeze frame figures (Zuckuss, RH Vader, etc.)
Episode 1 - no last two waves (Sio Bibble, etc.)
POTJ - no last two waves (Imperial officer, etc.)
Saga 1 - stopped around Djas Puhr
Episode 3 - the line sucked, but we missed something
Saga 2 - pretty much the last 22 never came here, save a smattering of Wally figs

See a trend?  Yet I can go into TRU right now and see so freaking much EndBoo wave it's sickening, just like when they ****** up the amount of the Carkoon wave.  Thanks for grasping what part of your product is good and what sucks ass as rehashes.   ::)

As for the parent company, some of it is just bizarre rehashes or the placing of desirable single figures in multi-packs with 3-4 other rehashed figures that I have no desire for.  The glut of product is getting a bit annoying too and I'm not army building or buying carded figures anymore, but there's just so much.  

Combine those two and I'm pretty tired overall of Hasbro.  There's still much to like, TAC wave 2 and all the McQuarrie stuff comes immediately to mind, but my patience is razor thin with these guys.  I'd rather find a GG mini-bust at $50 than buy 5 regular Hasbro figures (they're $10 up here), even army builders.

Could someone else do it?  Sure, like Scott mentioned Zizzle immediately leapt to mind given the scale and accuracy of the sculpts.  My biggest frustration with Hasbro is the price given what ToyBiz was able to do with LOTR at a higher scale.  Action features that didn't suck ass, great sculpts in a larger scale and lots of accessories as well.  Oh yeah, the pricepoint was the same.  I'll grant that the license was probably cheaper, but to suggest only Hasbro could do it?  Not a chance.  

To Hasbro's benefit though, I won't start collecting another line should they have competition.
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Offline CHEWIE

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Re: Your Loyalty?
« Reply #21 on: April 4, 2007, 10:04 PM »
I highly doubt I'd collect another line of 3-3/4 figures, unless they were vastly superior to what Hasbro's doing. 

If they outsourced vehicles or playsets though, that's another story.

 :P

Offline Darth_Anton

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Re: Your Loyalty?
« Reply #22 on: April 5, 2007, 10:01 AM »
I would definately drop the line if Hasbro lost the 3 3/4 inch licence. I also don't blame Hasbro for issues like the short packed MqStormie. The last two years they proved that they've been paying attention to trends and have gotten out the figures that people want in later revisions.
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Offline Rob

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Re: Your Loyalty?
« Reply #23 on: April 5, 2007, 11:17 AM »
I don't have any particular allegiance towards any one company, but I do think that on the whole, Hasbro does a very good job.   Sure there are downtimes when action features get worked in, or the articulation sucks, or the price goes up.  But there are also lots of times when they make new characters, delivery great collectibles, nail articulation and likenesses, listen to collectors, and their distribution seems to have improved too.  It's important to remember they have two very distinct target groups when it comes to kids and collectors.  They've said this all along and in general I think they've done a great job balancing those two.  It's not their problem if they put something out that is more geared to collectors and everyone gets into a tizzy about 'having' to buy it.

I would not collect any other scale and would only collect another company if they made them exactly the same style as Hasbro - so there you have it.  I don't see any reason for a change, especially at this point.


Offline TheBlackDog65

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Re: Your Loyalty?
« Reply #24 on: April 5, 2007, 11:47 AM »
No loyalty to Hasbro . . . for that matter at this point in my collecting my loyalty lies to what I like, what I am interested in, and if it fits with what I am doing currently. Thus whether it was Hasbro or another company, I don't think that will change. I know over the last year or so I've changed as has my collecting. It takes a lot now for Hasbro to get money from me as the figure has to be to my liking, interests me, and fits a theme I am currently collecting.
Having said that, like any toy line, Hasbro has grown and has done some good things and some not so good things. The proof is in the pudding so to speak. Look at how many people buy what Hasbro puts out regardless. I think that is loyalty to Star Wars not to Hasbro. Hasbro is the company with the license so that is what people buy. 
However, having been a huge collector of LOTR ToyBiz, I can say that when a line dies, you wish you had an alternative or that someone else would pick up the line. So since the Hasbro 3 3/4 line is not in overall danger, and more importantly, since there is plenty of money for Hasbro to make from people who buy the line from kids to collectors to those people who buy everything regardless. Because of that, Hasbro will be in the game until the profit and interest fades which I don't see happening for sometime.  Luckily, they You have to hand it to Lucas, from a marketing standpoint, the prequels brought life into collecting this line. As those who were 12 to 20 during the orginial series transition out of collecting, an whole new generation has come into collecting this line. As a result, I think Hasbro will be around for some time and overall, thought not perfect, having Hasbro hang around is not a bad thing overall.
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Offline Paul

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Re: Your Loyalty?
« Reply #25 on: April 5, 2007, 03:00 PM »
The loyalty I have for Hasbro is based on 2 things.  They are the successors to the Kenner line (which occupied so much of my childhood gift and cash spent) AND they did GI Joe (the other thing I collect).

Do I like everything they put out?  Nope.  That is the stuff I don't buy.  Do I wish they would do some things different? Yup.  That stuff I make a call on. 

I would be afraid for anyone else to get the license at this point...based on what every one else has done in this scale, I'd say Hasbro is the best option.  I won't go into detail but every other manufacturer of this scale messes SOMETHING up. Some have oversized hands and no articulation (comparatively), some have horrible head sculpts (yes worse humans than Hasbro), others have crappy plastic and terrible distribution and then there is the paint aps. I am in it for the FIGURES...so no amount of cool playset or vehicle is going to make up for it.

Now, if this thing gets relaunched by a different company in a different scale....it will depend on what they look like.  I personally do no like the Marvel Legends look....somebody mentioned LOTR...I would have gotten into that line, the sculpts seemed good and the representations were decent (I guess, I did not study it enough)...

I've stuck through GI Joes for 25 years now and restarted every time it did,  so I would probably be in.  Unless they are crappy...I'd rather collect some Star Wars figures than go back to1985 when there weren't any on the shelves to collect...

I think Hasbro can get to  2018 fairly easily.  If they did 5-6 VOTC style figures a year....that is only 55-60 more...they couldn't even finish the Vintage line up, much less taint it with PT stuff.

Offline Morgbug

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Re: Your Loyalty?
« Reply #26 on: April 5, 2007, 04:52 PM »
...they couldn't even finish the Vintage line up, much less taint it with PT stuff.

 ;D

 :-*
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Offline Jesse James

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Re: Your Loyalty?
« Reply #27 on: April 5, 2007, 09:51 PM »
Figured I'd chime in...

I have ZERO loyalty to Hasbro, which I suppose anyone who reads any of my reviews pretty much could guess.  That's not to say I dislike Hasbro or anything.  I dislike some of the decisions they make, I don't accept some of their answers as gospel either, especially seeing more and more of how other companies are set up and what they go through in the industry as well.  Hasbro generally, to me, doesn't have as many "excuses" as they enjoy pulling out for our benefit via Q&A's online and elsewhere.

That said, I think Hasbro's got the ability to do the best while MOST other companies would have to prove themselves more.

I can't really champion zizzle...  Their POTC figures are neat, but nowhere near the caliber of Hasbro's work I'm afraid, especially with the lacking articulation in their line and the lack of use of injection molded joints and such.  Zizzle doesn't get my vote.

If I had a company I do prefer what they do, generally, it's 21st Century Toys or BBI...  Articulation and sculpting are outstanding.  Distribution is less an issue of the company and more an issue of who the company is forced to deal with (respectively Wal-Mart and Toys R Us) exclusively.  I think they could do justice, but Hasbro's BEST foot forward is still better than either company I am afraid.

Vehicles excluded, of course.  Hasbro isn't in the vicinity of either of those companies when it comes to vehicles.  Hasbro has lightyears to go on that.

So, with that said, I just prefer Hasbro to PUT their best foot forward.  Not half-ass here and there, totally drop the ball here and there, and deliver an amazing figure the rest of the time.  It's their inconsistancy I hate because they can do better across the line generally.

That said, I'm pretty stoked by what I've seen for 2007...  Could be their best foot forward since the line started.  I'm hopeful.  I'm nowhere near loyal though.  They dont' cut my check, so I owe them nothing and  my $$$ pays their salaries so they owe me something I think.
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Offline inadvertent imitation

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Re: Your Loyalty?
« Reply #28 on: April 5, 2007, 10:32 PM »
I'm undecided where I stand. I'm no huge fan of Hasbro, even if they get most of my toy dollars. Things like the Botcon exclusives for Transformers and the various Star Wars con exclusives irk me to no end, not to mention 1x per case army builders in the SW and GI Joe lines.

But, they do as best as they can, I believe. It can't be easy to offer 70 or more figures a year and make people happy, but then again, they didn't make this line last a dozen years by making people completely happy. My loyalty would lie with Star Wars far before Hasbro, but if another company were to start a new line, I couldn't do it. I have enough, and I've collected this line since the first wave in 1995, and I've been waiting for figures like we're getting now for years, and I'm not going to support another company's learning curve with this license with my money. It's bad enough with Hasbro and Sideshow stuff.

At least, as difficult as some Star Wars figures are to obtain, Mattel doesn't have the toy license. I find it virtually impossible to find the Hot Wheels Barris Batmobile and the DC Superheroes line, and when I do find stuff from DCSH, it's just repainted Supermen that make not a lick of sense. I guess the point is, it could always be worse.

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Offline Nicklab

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Re: Your Loyalty?
« Reply #29 on: April 6, 2007, 01:03 AM »
My loyalty lies with good products.  Hasbro has definitely improved their product line over the years.  Look at the advances in the line since it was resurrected in 1995.  It's improved remarkably.  Does that take time?  Yeah.  Hasbro is a major manufacturer in their field and with the size of the company they can't exactly turn on a dime to make major improvements.  Smaller firms can do that, but they don't have the capital reserves to afford this kind of a major toy license.  As such I'll probably narrow my focus as Hasbro works their way towards their license end date of 2018.  I'll probably start to cherry pick their offerings if I don't like what they're doing.

I do notice that my own buying patterns have narrowed over the past couple of years.  I used to buy a lot of toy lines, and they varied between Toy Biz, McFarlane, NECA and Hasbro.  Now Toy Biz is gone and I'm much more selective in what I buy from McFarlane and NECA.  But I think that this is due more to the licenses these companies have than any kind of company based loyalty.

As for the options in the marketplace?  I'm not too impressed.  Zizzle is offering a lot of product, but the quality isn't there, pirate ship or not.  Mattel is doing work that's alright and they could probably afford the license fees, but what have they done in a 3-3/4" scale that could carry on the work that Kenner started?  McFarlane?  Not an option for me.  They're more interested in collectibles than they are in articulation and action oriented figures.  NECA is the same deal.  They do very nice work but they're doing work that's targetted at a much narrower audience.  Mezco?  Again, another boutique firm that does some nice work, but is geared toward a very specific audience.  The companies that are doing military lines are okay, but I don't think they have the capital to do what's necessary for a Star Wars line to succeed commercially.  At the very least they don't have the money to pay Lucasfilm what they would want in exchange for the master toy license.  I don't know what company does Power Rangers.  I think it might be Bandai.  They probably have the cash, especially since Power Rangers have been among the best selling boy's toys lines for a number of years.  But would they be able to offer something that would fit in with what both Kenner and Hasbro have established?  Personally I think their work looks like kiddie-crap.  I won't even buy it for my nephews.  It just looks bad.

This whole discussion is really an exercise in hypotheticals though.  Hasbro has the license through 2018.  That's another 11 years.  Certainly in that time they could sell off the license to another company if it makes business sense, but I see that as unlikely.  As for the product?  If their work doesn't resonate with the collecting community, they're going to have to adapt.  They're a slave to their sales numbers.  So if they're offering product that we don't want to buy, they're going to have to respond.  And with a decline in Star Wars presence in pop culture with no more movies on the horizon, they're going to have to work to hold our interest.  The television projects will probably help that, but Hasbro is going to have to continue to innovate or fail.  So in that regard I think we should be asking just how loyal is Hasbro prepared to be to the collector base?
« Last Edit: April 7, 2007, 12:04 PM by Nicklab »
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