Author Topic: Force Unleashed - Vader's Apprentice (Spoilers)  (Read 3600 times)

Offline CorranHorn

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Force Unleashed - Vader's Apprentice (Spoilers)
« on: October 12, 2007, 06:10 PM »
Hi All,

I didn't see if this was discussed before, so my apologies if I'm retreading something here. There are some spoilers to the Force Unleashed game and storyline, so beware
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From the The Wizards of the Coast Force Unleashed webpage...
Quote
From an early age, the Apprentice was secretly raised by Darth Vader, who trained him in the power of the dark side of the Force. By the time the Secret Apprentice reached adulthood, Vader's training had made him one of the most powerful Force-wielders in the galaxy. After Order 66, Vader sent the Secret Apprentice on missions to destroy the last of the Jedi, and he became one the most lethal weapons Vader had at his disposal. (The roleplaying game statistics below represent Vader's protégé fairly early in his apprenticeship, before he manifests his true potential by unleashing the Force.)

This bothers me a bit as it implied Anakin had a hidden apprentice before Revenge of the Sith. Anakin wasn't a knight that long before ROTS, yet he felt he could have an apprentice? Sure he was confident in his own powers, but neither the movies or the established EU give any indication that he felt he could train someone himself. And if this guy has been his apprentice for quite a while before ROTS, why would Anakin take on an apprentice while still being a Padawan himself? What was there for him to gain, is it just a matter of him saying he could do what the Masters could do?

Seems a bit of a stretch to me. I could see Vader having an apprentice after ROTS as he's following the path of the Sith and the Dark Side, but Anakin as a Jedi Padawn with an apprentice while he himself is still training just doesn't sound right. Am I missing something here or has the continual re-writing of the movies and EU struck again?

Offline Ryan

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Re: Force Unleashed - Vader's Apprentice (Spoilers)
« Reply #1 on: October 12, 2007, 08:52 PM »
I think it all depends on how far between ANH and ROTS the game is set to take place. Remember there is a 20 year gap there. I'm not sure when it is that it is supposed to be but I'd assume it is at least 10 years asfter ROTS if not closer to 15. If that is indeed the case, Anakin feasibly could have taken up an apprentice IMMEDIATELY following his transformation into Vader. I think Vader always had plans to overthrow Palpatine, even if it was just to place himself on the thrown, it is the Sith way afterall. If he took some kid who was only about 10 years old or so at the time of ROTS, he then would be about 25 come the time of TFU. So I think it should work out, depending on when the game is actually set.
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Offline Jesse James

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Re: Force Unleashed - Vader's Apprentice (Spoilers)
« Reply #2 on: October 13, 2007, 01:37 AM »
I think one could also apply the "from a certain POV" thing too...

In the prequals we see that there are force adepts that the Jedi simply abandon due to age or whatever reason.  So they're out there, floating around...  I think it's entirely possible that, while in his travels and general rompings in the galaxy, Anakin befriends a force-adept that the Jedi aren't willing to train for whatever reason...  But Anakin maintains a "friendship" with him.  Call it an apprenticeship if you want, but I could also see a simple friendship being construed as that as well...  they talk, maybe Anakin shows a trick or two to the guy...  As he gets older, he maybe developes some of it himself too...  When Ani becomes Vader, he then says, "hey Joe...  Wanna see something REALLY cool you can do with the force?", and now he's really become an apprentice and such...

Anakin's possible befriending and unintentional mentoring an abandoned force-adept is something I can bite on...  I think then the title of "apprentice" is really just from that "certain point of view" and nothing more.  That, at least to me, can squeeze this into believable EU in my world anyway, if that makes any sense at all Jason.

But him training (intentionally) a force-adept in secret in the ways of the darkside and things, long before Anakin is actually evil, well that is nothing I'd bite on I don't think.
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Offline Ryan

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Re: Force Unleashed - Vader's Apprentice (Spoilers)
« Reply #3 on: October 13, 2007, 12:36 PM »
I don't know, thought I saw in one of the FU videos that the kid was supposedly taken at a young age, like this story suggests, but that Vader tortured him. A LOT. This apprentice is supposeldy really disconnected from the world and is very child-like when it come to dealing with Juno Eclipse. They suggest that is because he has been so cut off from the outside world since he was a little kid.

Lucas did sign off on the story (duh), but I think he had a lot to do with this one. So hopefully that is a sign that the continuity will all work out. I really can't wait for this game to see for myself. :)
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Offline CorranHorn

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Re: Force Unleashed - Vader's Apprentice (Spoilers)
« Reply #4 on: October 13, 2007, 06:23 PM »
See the way I read it, if taken literal means he had an apprentice before Order 66 (ROTS) and after the order was given the apprentice went after the Jedi. Now my understanding is the game only takes place maybe 3-5 years after ROTS.  While I think your ideas work if everything mentioned in that blurb took place after ROTS, it just doesn't synch with the timeframe I've heard the game takes place in and that's where I continue to be confused.

As an aside, I can see that Vader took an apprentice, any fans of the Marvel comics will recall a boy named Flint who Vader trained in the dark side. And there was that Lumiya chick too... :)
« Last Edit: October 13, 2007, 06:23 PM by CorranHorn »

Offline Jesse James

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Re: Force Unleashed - Vader's Apprentice (Spoilers)
« Reply #5 on: October 13, 2007, 11:42 PM »
Apprentice, and friendly mentor, are pretty slippery verbal slopes though, no?
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Offline CorranHorn

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Re: Force Unleashed - Vader's Apprentice (Spoilers)
« Reply #6 on: October 15, 2007, 05:22 PM »
Apprentice, and friendly mentor, are pretty slippery verbal slopes though, no?

So if we go through the "Friendly mentor" pov, that would imply that Anakin's relationship to this apprentice is similar to that of Palpatine to Anakin, no?

Offline Jesse James

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Re: Force Unleashed - Vader's Apprentice (Spoilers)
« Reply #7 on: October 15, 2007, 10:25 PM »
Yeah, I would agree...  Anakin was mentored by Palpy before he was apprenticed, yes...  Could be a very similar story, really.  Of course, it seemingly doesn't end the same.
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Offline Nicklab

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Re: Force Unleashed - Vader's Apprentice (Spoilers)
« Reply #8 on: October 25, 2007, 12:40 PM »
See the way I read it, if taken literal means he had an apprentice before Order 66 (ROTS) and after the order was given the apprentice went after the Jedi. Now my understanding is the game only takes place maybe 3-5 years after ROTS.  While I think your ideas work if everything mentioned in that blurb took place after ROTS, it just doesn't synch with the timeframe I've heard the game takes place in and that's where I continue to be confused.

As an aside, I can see that Vader took an apprentice, any fans of the Marvel comics will recall a boy named Flint who Vader trained in the dark side. And there was that Lumiya chick too... :)


I think that this storyline takes place closer to ANH than it does to ROTS.  And there are actually Force adepts that the Empire employs after Order 66.  In the webstrip Evasive Action on the official site there's an extensive storyline in which both Vader and the Emporer employ Force adepts who were cast out from the Jedi as minions.  Vader chose one named Tremayne to act as an emmisary because he had a predilection for the Dark Side. 

Tremayne was part of the agricultural corps (or something like that), which was an organization that masterless padawans would go to if their studies with the Jedi didn't progress.  They all varied in age, depending on when the Jedi came to consider these younglings and padawans unworthy or untrainable.  So there are known Force adepts out there that Vader could choose from.  He may have known of one of these younglings before he was sent to the agri-corps, but from what I've read of The Force Unleashed it sounds like Vader trains him in secret.  And I think it all happens post Order 66.
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Offline Jesse James

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Re: Force Unleashed - Vader's Apprentice (Spoilers)
« Reply #9 on: October 25, 2007, 09:37 PM »
To take that a step further in the EU, the "Emperor's Inner Circle" of force-adepts are of course characters like Mara Jade who was used as an assassin, Maarek Steele who was used as a Top Ace Imperial Pilot due to his force abilities, and so on...  I can buy the recruitment of force adepts...

Even if the storyline is closer to ROTS though, I still like the concept that Anakin had someone he was sort of mentoring in his spare time like Palpy mentored him...  I think that's interesting, and possible, but I don't think he'd really have laid out the "big stuff" as far as force powers go, till after O66.  Then I see him just sort of lighting up and saying to this guy, "hey, guess what I can show you how to do!  It's great!", and thus this new guy's born...  Ultimately the guy's probably doomed though.  Kind of like Assajj and Dooku/Palpatine.
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Offline Nicklab

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Re: Force Unleashed - Vader's Apprentice (Spoilers)
« Reply #10 on: December 27, 2007, 10:05 PM »
Well, the timeline for the Secret Apprentice's training with Vader has been set.  The new book Jedi VS Sith - The Essential Guide To The Force sets the apprenticeship starting at 18 years before the Battle of Yavin.
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Offline jedipurge

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Re: Force Unleashed - Vader's Apprentice (Spoilers)
« Reply #11 on: December 31, 2007, 02:51 PM »
I would've definately guessed closer to ANH then to ROTS.  If we look at the figures a little, while they might not totally be a basis for some of the story the one chick with the baton sabers originally had Green Saber & Hasbro changed them to Red because of a misunderstanding that she had been a good guy, the F'ed up Vader has the Shaw head instead of a Hayden head suggesting that it's the older Vader not the younger.  Also somewhere I read that it was the Rebels that F'ed him up in the first place, in ANH the Rebels were still just a fledgling group really stealing the plans of the DS was their first real campaign.
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Offline CorranHorn

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Re: Force Unleashed - Vader's Apprentice (Spoilers)
« Reply #12 on: February 6, 2008, 05:57 PM »
Well, the timeline for the Secret Apprentice's training with Vader has been set.  The new book Jedi VS Sith - The Essential Guide To The Force sets the apprenticeship starting at 18 years before the Battle of Yavin.

And that's what screws the whole thing up in my mind. Your previous idea and thoughts, along with JJ's, where we move away from ROTS in the timeline made sense and worked well with the established EU. Well that's the great thing about the EU, you can make it whatever you want to be. And to me, Vader doesn't have an apprentice immediately after going all armored.  ;D
« Last Edit: February 6, 2008, 05:59 PM by CorranHorn »

Offline clonebuyer111

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Re: Force Unleashed - Vader's Apprentice (Spoilers)
« Reply #13 on: May 14, 2008, 05:12 PM »
so whos son does the apprentice end up being?

Offline David

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Re: Force Unleashed - Vader's Apprentice (Spoilers)
« Reply #14 on: May 15, 2008, 07:33 PM »
so whos son does the apprentice end up being?

Obi-Wan's! :o

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