Author Topic: Star Trek  (Read 106541 times)

Offline Nicklab

  • Jedi Sentinel
  • *
  • Posts: 13810
  • I saw we fight!
    • View Profile
Re: Star Trek
« Reply #315 on: July 7, 2016, 11:22 PM »
A friend of mine from work who is a die hard Trek fan hates all things JJ Abrams.  He sat out Into Darkness and is doubly pissed about what Paramount has done to the fan community recently with Axanar and Star Trek Continues.

This Sulu crap will piss him off even more!  :D

I'm pissed about the Axanar situation.  That short film was fantastic.  And the fact that they were able to get some decent actors for the project (who had been in legit ST projects) was a big part of what set it apart from most fan films. And that had me genuinely excited for the movie.  But I get the sense that they were too good for Paramounts tastes. 
"Call up a Hammerhead Corvette.  I have an idea."

Feedback

Offline Darby

  • Jedi Knight
  • *
  • Posts: 4236
  • I'm not with that guy
    • View Profile
    • darbyharn.com
Re: Star Trek
« Reply #316 on: July 8, 2016, 01:12 AM »
I find Takei's perspective interesting, even if I disagree with it. Sulu's sexuality has never been established to any significance (Melora could have just as easily been the product of a gay marriage) so if there's one character it makes sense... also this is alternate timeline, and alt timelines have shown normally straight characters to be... flexible (Kira), so... it's a great step forward for Trek which has been progressive in just about every social issue but this one. It's too bad Takei feels this way.

Offline Jesse James

  • Staff Member
  • Grand Master
  • *
  • Posts: 35448
  • Slippery When Poopy
    • View Profile
    • JediDefender.com
Re: Star Trek
« Reply #317 on: July 8, 2016, 01:22 AM »
I think I get where he's coming from with it...  Being he established the character, I kinda wish they'd have engaged him on the future of the character if for no other reason than to see what he thinks, but I mean I get it in a way.

On the other hand, like you Darb, I feel like it's nice to establish one of the main bridge crew as gay...  It's certainly something they've not done with any of the characters before. 

I'm amazed anyone cares since I see so much hate for the new Trek, haha.  I was never a diehard TOS guy...  I liked it fine enough, just it never resonated with me like TNG did, and I feel like the new one is all popcorn but I still enjoy it.
2011 Rebel Fleet Trooper Gets My Seal Of Approval!  But Where's The Friggin' Holster On Him!?
Jedi Defender.com Contributing Editor, Twitter @JediDefender & @Jesse_James77

Offline McMetal

  • Jedi Master
  • *
  • Posts: 7145
    • View Profile
Re: Star Trek
« Reply #318 on: July 8, 2016, 08:53 AM »
Apparently Takei himself feels it's not what Roddenberry would've wanted, but then again the Trek franchise hasn't been what Roddenberry wanted since back in the TNG days before he died, and IMHO it improved without him after he died.  :-X

Yeah, I believe his exact quote was "very unfortunate" and while this surprised me at first after reading into it I can see his point. His take was that Sulu was always envisioned as a heterosexual character and that it would have been a better choice to make a new character gay rather than re-imagining an existing one. His respect for Roddenberry and the source material was pretty refreshing actually.

I agree he seems like a very likeable dude in a genuine way.
A character’s face is melted by fantastical energy

Offline JediJman

  • Jedi Guardian
  • *
  • Posts: 18061
  • I don't get drunk, I get awesome.
    • View Profile
Re: Star Trek
« Reply #319 on: July 8, 2016, 11:05 AM »
Yeah, there is some interesting background on this story.  Apparently it was Simon Pegg's idea and intended as a homage to Takei, but when Takei found out LAST YEAR, he expressed his displeasure with Sulu being gay and did his best to convince Cho to go another route.  Takei wanted them to introduce a new gay character rather than mess with Sulu's legacy, but they ignored him and went with it anyway. 

If they were really doing this to support Takei (who is awesome), I would be all for it.  The fact that Takei didn't want this to happen and was trying to get them to go another route tells me that this is just another lame publicity stunt to get people talking about the movie.  Black Johnny Storm, anyone?  It really bothers me that Takei knew and tried to get them to change it and they did nothing - that is the exact opposite of supporting his legacy.

I wasn't that excited to see this movie in the first place - now I'm definitely out.
Climbed a mountain & never came back. I will not quit & I always fight back 
From this moment for all my life. What could I say? Was born to be this way. And what could I say?  Just livin' for today

Online Jeff

  • Administrator
  • Jedi Elder
  • *
  • Posts: 26321
  • Leave me where I lie
    • View Profile
    • www.JediDefender.com
Re: Star Trek
« Reply #320 on: July 8, 2016, 11:37 AM »
I wasn't that excited to see this movie in the first place - now I'm definitely out.

Sulu is/isn't gay has no bearing on me not wanting to see it... I don't want to see it because I saw the "we swear it's not Khan" one and that movie was so bad (so bad I can't even recall the name and won't even bother looking for it), I pretty much swore off seeing any more of these New Trek movies. :P
Editor-in-Chief  - www.JediDefender.com
On Twitter?  Follow JediDefender -> @jedidefender

Offline Dave

  • Jedi Master
  • *
  • Posts: 6216
  • Never Trust a Big Butt and a Smile - BBD
    • View Profile
Re: Star Trek
« Reply #321 on: July 8, 2016, 11:52 AM »
Maybe its just a PR stunt, or pandering, but I don't really get why someone's sexuality is even all that important unless its relevant to the plot. 

I can honestly say I've never thought about Sulu, or Chekov's, or Scotty, or Bones' sexuality as it hasn't been all that relevant.  Maybe I'm forgetting an episode or two from the '60s, or a scene from one of the movies, but for the most part the only main characters that seemed to have any sexuality as part of their core character were Kirk, Uhura, and Spock.

If Sulu has a kid that is at risk in the new movie and its relevant to the plot, fine.  But why should it matter if he is hetero, homo, bi, or asexual.  And if the kid was born in a hetero relationship, born through a surrogate mother (in any kind of relationship), or adopted in to any kind of family. 

Why should it matter???

I'm sure people would argue that gay people need to seen as role models in movies to feel accepted in society, etc, but where does it stop?  Do we need all sub-segments of society represented in blockbuster films?

I've probably answered my own question as I'm guessing this is just PR or pandering.  They should have just left Sulu be an Asian dude that pilots a starship without having his sexuality be part of the discussion.

Offline Darby

  • Jedi Knight
  • *
  • Posts: 4236
  • I'm not with that guy
    • View Profile
    • darbyharn.com
Re: Star Trek
« Reply #322 on: July 8, 2016, 12:43 PM »
Any character being straight has no bearing on the plot either, except it does factor, in almost every narrative ever. So a character being gay should also factor, even if it has no direct impact on the plot. Anyone being gay/straight/whatever also has no bearing on me seeing this movie or any other. Like Jeff said the train wreck that was Into Darkness nearly put me off these movies for good, but I'm starting to have hopes for this one. I think if Takei was that adamant about Sulu not being gay, I personally would have listened to him if I were writing the movie, but as Pegg said this morning, a new character would have been the token gay character and that's worse than retconning an existing one. Which this is not. Like I said Sulu being gay or straight is canonically open for debate. I think it's overdue for Trek, a great if unwanted tribute to Takei, and no, it shouldn't matter. But it does.

Offline JediJman

  • Jedi Guardian
  • *
  • Posts: 18061
  • I don't get drunk, I get awesome.
    • View Profile
Re: Star Trek
« Reply #323 on: July 8, 2016, 12:48 PM »
Sulu is/isn't gay has no bearing on me not wanting to see it... I don't want to see it because I saw the "we swear it's not Khan" one and that movie was so bad (so bad I can't even recall the name and won't even bother looking for it), I pretty much swore off seeing any more of these New Trek movies. :P

Just to be clear - I could care less if any of the characters are gay or not.  I'll even go so far as to say they should have a gay character given how Roddenberry was deliberately inclusive of both genders and many races in the original series.  Even if its not necessary for the story, I can see where this might have been included with the original material back in the day.

I just don't want to support the movie for using the gay card as PR when the actor they were supposedly trying to support asked them to not to go this route.  I actually kind of like the new Star Trek stuff, but am already sensitive to this stuff with Marvel revamping all their characters lately in much the same vein.  If you really want to include minorities in your stories to make your cast more representative, then do it organically with new characters and do it for a reason other than building up hype and controversy. 
Climbed a mountain & never came back. I will not quit & I always fight back 
From this moment for all my life. What could I say? Was born to be this way. And what could I say?  Just livin' for today

Offline P-Siddy

  • Jedi General
  • *
  • Posts: 9380
    • View Profile
Re: Star Trek
« Reply #324 on: July 8, 2016, 10:06 PM »
Apparently it was Simon Pegg's idea and intended as a homage to Takei, but when Takei found out LAST YEAR, he expressed his displeasure with Sulu being gay and did his best to convince Cho to go another route.

Considering all this and that Simon was one of the writers, why didn't he volunteer his character, Scotty, to be gay?  I mean, instead of disagreeing with George on the reasonings, he could have easily change which characters was gay, instead of disregarding George's wish.

Offline Scockery

  • Jedi Knight
  • *
  • Posts: 2826
    • View Profile
Re: Star Trek
« Reply #325 on: July 9, 2016, 04:46 PM »
Marina Sertis (butchered that spelling I'm sure) on the other hand...  yikes, she seemed kinda angry.

If you can't take Marina's attitude, then you might think of going to a transport ship convention. There's a lot less pressure there.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CV_iEPPlUM

Offline Diddly

  • Jedi Master
  • *
  • Posts: 6359
  • SECede
    • View Profile
Re: Star Trek
« Reply #326 on: July 22, 2016, 11:06 AM »
Anyone see Beyond? I'm on the fence and my roommate says it's alright but isn't worth seeing.
http://diddlyscoop.blogspot.com
Twitter: @travis_banks

Offline Pete_Fett

  • Jedi Knight
  • *
  • Posts: 3737
  • Jedi Killer
    • View Profile
Re: Star Trek
« Reply #327 on: July 23, 2016, 11:10 PM »
Anyone see Beyond? I'm on the fence and my roommate says it's alright but isn't worth seeing.

My wife and I saw it Thursday night and we both loved it.

Keep in mind that while I have been a fan of Star Trek since I was a kid, I am by no means a Star Trek "purist" - I loved the 2009 reboot movie and I enjoyed Into Darkness but thought it could have been better.

I felt Beyond was the best of the reboot cast movies so far, a fun thrill ride, with a pretty interesting plot and an interesting twist at the end that if you're paying attention, you'll see clues for well before it's revealed in the movie.

I would recommend going to see it.
Peter

Letting my collecting OCD get the better of me on a DAILY basis... and loving EVERY minute of it!

Offline Scockery

  • Jedi Knight
  • *
  • Posts: 2826
    • View Profile
Re: Star Trek
« Reply #328 on: July 24, 2016, 12:01 AM »
USS Discovery First Look.

Ugly. What was the last decent looking ship? Voyager?


Offline Nicklab

  • Jedi Sentinel
  • *
  • Posts: 13810
  • I saw we fight!
    • View Profile
Re: Star Trek
« Reply #329 on: July 24, 2016, 12:20 AM »
USS Discovery First Look.

Ugly. What was the last decent looking ship? Voyager?



The aft section of the ship looks... Klingon!
"Call up a Hammerhead Corvette.  I have an idea."

Feedback