Author Topic: Superman - Man of Steel  (Read 4417 times)

Offline DSJ™

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Re: Superman - Man of Steel
« Reply #90 on: June 17, 2013, 01:47 PM »
Mentioned long ago... it was a WFT did Jonathan say?

Quote
Clark: "What was I supposed to do let them die?"

Jonathan: "...Maybe"

He made his choice!

Remember, it's a reboot... not really the Sup's we grew up with.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2013, 01:51 PM by DSJ™ »

Offline Qui-Gon Jim

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Re: Superman - Man of Steel
« Reply #91 on: June 17, 2013, 03:06 PM »


Remember, it's a reboot... not really the Sup's we grew up with.

This is a horse<bleep> cop out excuse.  This is not tied to the movies we saw when we were young, and I'm OK with that.  BUT they are tied to decades of Superman lore since the movie is called Supe... oh wait...

I think I am more bothered that he was ABLE to do it rather than him doing it.

Also, which blockbuster genre film tidies things up with a "singularity"?  Hint: it isn't Star Trek.

Offline Jayson

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Re: Superman - Man of Steel
« Reply #92 on: June 17, 2013, 03:13 PM »


Remember, it's a reboot... not really the Sup's we grew up with.

This is a horse<bleep> cop out excuse.  This is not tied to the movies we saw when we were young, and I'm OK with that.  BUT they are tied to decades of Superman lore since the movie is called Supe... oh wait...

I think I am more bothered that he was ABLE to do it rather than him doing it.

Also, which blockbuster genre film tidies things up with a "singularity"?  Hint: it isn't Star Trek.

I would say that since Kal-El wasn't born of genetic engineering and has the codex of all of Kryptonians I say he could kill him.
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Offline JediJman

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Re: Superman - Man of Steel
« Reply #93 on: June 17, 2013, 04:38 PM »
Haven't seen it yet, but intrigured to from all the posts.  I have to say on the surface, I agree with QGJ is saying about Superman's ending.  Seems like he would have tried to find another way.  Great article on the whole issue right here from EW.
"If trees could scream, would we be so cavalier about cutting them down? We might, if they screamed all the time, for no good reason. " -Jack Handey

Offline Jayson

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Re: Superman - Man of Steel
« Reply #94 on: June 17, 2013, 05:07 PM »
The author of that must not have seen Superman 2. In that film, Superman crushes a Zod's hand (who is now "mortal" at this point) and throws him against the wall and to his eventual death in the FoS - all while smiling and wisecracking. Zod and Co. in Superman 2 no longer posed an imminent threat. Did we think any less of Superman?

I'd say that in MOS, Superman was far more cognizant of his actions and their ramifications. What was Kal-El's recourse exactly?

Take the superhero aspect out of it. A psychopath is mowing down innocent civilians in the street. Law enforcement/military is forced to neutralize the threat with extreme prejudice to prevent further loss of life. Do we deem them as murderers?

Superman did what needed to be done.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2013, 05:11 PM by Jayson »
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Offline Brian

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Re: Superman - Man of Steel
« Reply #95 on: June 17, 2013, 09:02 PM »
Went yesterday and I really enjoyed it as well.  I really enjoyed it pretty much from beginning to end, and hope that it springboards to a united DCU ala the Marvel movie world.  I have to admit during the big Metropolis battle scenes thinking "how cool would it be if Batman came flying in in the batwing and started firing on that thing too".  The fact that this could open the door to that type of thing eventually is exciting.  I can see the point about all the building smashing and stuff, it almost did get overdone at some point, but overall it was pretty cool.  You could definitely tell it was a bit of a reaction to Superman Returns where everyone was saying "HIT SOMETHING!!!", because there was plenty of it this time around.  Overall, I really liked the movie though - and the cast in general.  I think I enjoyed this more than Iron Man 3 even, and this from someone who is more of a Marvel guy overall.  Our daughter loved it too, although one of her first comments coming out of the theater was "I was hoping Supergirl would show up" :).  I do hope that this success opens the door to at least a Wonder Woman movie being made, because I know my daughter is just aching to see a female superhero movie - or at least appearances by Supergirl, Batgirl, WW, She Hulk, new Invisible Woman, etc.  Oh, and she wants a Teen Titans movie :).  Anyways, Man of Steel gets a thumbs up from me.

On the more spoilery side...


I read an interesting blog from Mark Waid (big comic writer and Supes fan, and author of Birthright which a lot of Man of Steel was pulled from), and he comments about all the collateral damage, in addition to the whole Zod thing at the end.  It is an interesting read here:

http://thrillbent.com/blog/man-of-steel-since-you-asked/

I admit to thinking about that a little bit too, and I didn't read this blog entry until after I saw the movie.  I kept thinking about how Superman didn't even seem to be avoiding all the building smashing and how many people were probably dying in those buildings.  But, at the same time, I can see how this approach is a little more "realistic", since if something like this was actually happening - unfortunately, people were going to die.  Anyways, it is a good read either way.

Offline JediJman

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Re: Superman - Man of Steel
« Reply #96 on: June 18, 2013, 10:22 AM »
The author of that must not have seen Superman 2. In that film, Superman crushes a Zod's hand (who is now "mortal" at this point) and throws him against the wall and to his eventual death in the FoS - all while smiling and wisecracking. Zod and Co. in Superman 2 no longer posed an imminent threat. Did we think any less of Superman?

That's a great point, though to be fair the audience doesn't really "see" the death.  I never really thought of Zod and company as falling down a deep well to splatter on the frozen ice below - maybe the fortress cyrogenically freezes them or something?  I guess the difference for me is not knowing and not seeing it versus watching Supes snap someone's neck. 

I'd also absolutely agree with having to kill someone to save innocent lives.  I haven't seen it yet, but given the situation as I've read it the script put him in a position where he was justified in killing.  However, that's really in direct contrast to his boy scout nature depicted in decades of comics, TV, and movies.  It was clearly done for shock value, which is always going to make some people happy and some people not. 

Someone did mention that the reaction moments after killing Zod was light hearted, which does feel like a missed opportunity to show some remorse for the loss of life.  I think this is the kind of thing that directors forget these days - taking 60 seconds to show some human reaction and emotion.  One of my favorite scenes in Star Wars is when Luke is yearning to live his own life and sulks off to watch the horizon as the twin suns are setting.  No words, no crazy CGI - just that honest sense of heart ache that everyone in the audience can relate to.  It's too bad that scenes like that have lost their place in the big budget action world.
"If trees could scream, would we be so cavalier about cutting them down? We might, if they screamed all the time, for no good reason. " -Jack Handey

Offline Jayson

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Re: Superman - Man of Steel
« Reply #97 on: June 18, 2013, 10:56 AM »
Someone did mention that the reaction moments after killing Zod was light hearted, which does feel like a missed opportunity to show some remorse for the loss of life.  I think this is the kind of thing that directors forget these days - taking 60 seconds to show some human reaction and emotion.  One of my favorite scenes in Star Wars is when Luke is yearning to live his own life and sulks off to watch the horizon as the twin suns are setting.  No words, no crazy CGI - just that honest sense of heart ache that everyone in the audience can relate to.  It's too bad that scenes like that have lost their place in the big budget action world.

In the MoS, Superman is clearly distraught after he kills Zod... screaming "No" from his knees... then being physically consoled by Lois. They don't linger on it much but it is there.
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Offline Qui-Gon Jim

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Re: Superman - Man of Steel
« Reply #98 on: June 18, 2013, 12:35 PM »
I think that if they had shown Superman trying in vain to save lives while slowly but surely losing the fight to Zod's men, then his killing of Zod would have been more powerful.  When we see Superman happily fighting in the streets of his hometown destroying buildings, it doesn't show any part of his character that "cares" for humanity.  I kept waiting for Clark to lead the fight out of the town and into the fields, but stuff don't get blow'd up as good in a field, I guess.

If handled better, then Superman having to kill, and worse, kill his last "countryman" it could have led to some interesting stuff for the sequel.  With this, the fallout was barely dealt with.

Offline Jayson

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Re: Superman - Man of Steel
« Reply #99 on: June 18, 2013, 01:25 PM »
If handled better, then Superman having to kill, and worse, kill his last "countryman" it could have led to some interesting stuff for the sequel.  With this, the fallout was barely dealt with.

Or did he? ;) remember the capsules on the sentry ship? One crew member was dead inside the other capsule was open and empty.... Could there be another Kryptonian among us?
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Offline JediJman

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Re: Superman - Man of Steel
« Reply #100 on: June 18, 2013, 01:25 PM »
In the MoS, Superman is clearly distraught after he kills Zod... screaming "No" from his knees.

In that case, I really have no problem with it.  Guess I need to actually go see the movie!
"If trees could scream, would we be so cavalier about cutting them down? We might, if they screamed all the time, for no good reason. " -Jack Handey

Offline BillCable

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Re: Superman - Man of Steel
« Reply #101 on: June 18, 2013, 01:35 PM »
Or did he? ;) remember the capsules on the sentry ship? One crew member was dead inside the other capsule was open and empty.... Could there be another Kryptonian among us?

Plus everyone who was on board the ship is back in the Phantom Zone.
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Offline Diddly

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Re: Superman - Man of Steel
« Reply #102 on: June 19, 2013, 05:53 AM »
Finally got around to seeing this yesterday after work, and I liked it for the most part. I'd say it was just as good as Iron Man 3 (which I liked), although while I would say that IM3 was more exciting/entertaining, MoS was a better overall movie.

Things I liked:
- Casting was AWESOME. Specifically Costner and Crowe. They both OWNED their respective roles. Cavill did fine as Supes and Amy Adams was good too.
- I'm not really a big Superman fan but they did a great job with Krypton, making it seem like a gigantic world with its own goings on rather than just a bunch of ice crystals. In fact, I'd say they did so well of a job that I wouldn't mind a whole movie set there.
- Smallville/growing up scenes were well done too. LOVED the parts where Supes wants to beat the snot out of the bullies but refrains. Really made the part where he finally unleashes on Zod that much powerful.
- The score was great in some parts, just there in others though
- I didn't mind the (spoiler) of (spoiler) at the end

Things I didn't like:
- The fighting/action, while there was a lot, blended together after a while, and it was hard to tell what exactly was going on at certain points
- Ma Kent was pretty useless
- I feel like 10-20 minutes could have easily been trimmed

Overall, sooooooooooooo much better than Superman Returns, but a different beast from the Reeve movies (even though I've only seen the first).

Offline BillCable

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Re: Superman - Man of Steel
« Reply #103 on: June 19, 2013, 10:22 AM »
I got a laugh from this:

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Offline Scockery

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Re: Superman - Man of Steel
« Reply #104 on: July 4, 2013, 06:46 PM »
I finally saw it  I get tired of origin movies, but most of the origin parts were the good parts and the rest was by the numbers.

I found it odd was that Zod's crew instantly know what to do with super powers (except super senses), lunging themselves at A-10's and hurling train cars.

Lois Lane is full of plot conveniences, especially her arriving at the museum or where ever Supes and Zod have their last tussle. She's also the only person Superman saves in the midst all the Metropolis devastation is going on (we assume he assisted with saving afterwards).

At the end, how could the military not figure out he's Clark Kent, if Lane did it in under a week?

There's the big stupid. The biggest of all. We on Earth, with our measely tech, can detect Earth-like worlds. But Zod and his space ship couldn't? They found colonies in ruins, but no potential planets to terraform with their thinga-ma-bob? REALLY? More likely they'd have made New Krypton first and searched for Kal-El later.  If they just wanted Kal-el, then the movie wouldn't have the  Earth/humanity in danger scenario. Stakes always have to be huge  ::) .

And going back to save the dog. ZACK SNYDER, YOU DID THAT ALREADY IN DAWN OF THE DEAD! It was stupid then and it was stupid here.