Author Topic: Post your ROTS reviews and thoughts!  (Read 11578 times)

Offline DoctorPadawan

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Re: Post your ROTS reviews and thoughts!
« Reply #60 on: May 22, 2005, 10:45 AM »
Just a couple of comments on the lack of Shaak Ti in the film.  She actually had two different death scenes filmed, but neither showed up.  The first one had her being involved in the raid on the General's cruiser.  She was already on board (whether as a prisoner or an infiltrator, I don't know) and it was her homing beacon that led Obi-Wan and Anakin to the ship.  Obi-Wan and Anakin were on their way through the ship to get to Palpatine when they came upon Shaak Ti standing in the middle of the hall crying.  When they came closer, Grievous appeared behind her and stabbed her through the back with a lightsaber (possibly her own; this would also explain early images of the ROTS action figure that had a hole in her chest just big enough to insert a saber blade so it would stick out).  When he attempted to come after them, they used their sabers to cut a hole in the floor and drop down to the next level.

Apparently Lucas decided there was too much going on in the beginning of the film, so her death scene was reshot and put in a new section of the movie.  When Vader enters the Jedi Temple, there was a scene shot where he comes upon Shaak Ti meditating in a room that looks a lot like Yoda's.  I don't know how he did it, but Vader kills her while she is meditating.

There are images of all these scenes (the former being animatics with actual actor footage; the latter being a single still photo) in the "Making of ROTS" book.  Is it outside the realm of possibility to do an identified cut scenes thread for the board?  I don't know how long it will be before T-Bone Fender starts to put a section together on his site (there is no better Cut Scenes archive on the web than his, IMO), and I've already caught several things (such as the shot of Palpatine's shuttle returning to Coruscant from the second trailer and a scene I saw on the TV Guide channel of Padme, Mon Mothma, and some other senators in her apartment) that were shot for the film but not included.  It'd be cool to have all these together in one spot.

Offline Herbert_Ackermans

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Re: Post your ROTS reviews and thoughts!
« Reply #61 on: May 22, 2005, 11:50 AM »
I've read people being moved and some even being brought to tears, but the whole Aayla Secura killing-scene actualy made me laugh out.

It is so over the top, those Clonetroopers blasting away, just to make sure she's dead.

Offline Bob Crane

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Re: Post your ROTS reviews and thoughts!
« Reply #62 on: May 22, 2005, 12:03 PM »
What became of the Sypho Dias mystery- ah, nothing?
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Offline speedermike

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Re: Post your ROTS reviews and thoughts!
« Reply #63 on: May 22, 2005, 04:00 PM »
"No, Leia remembering her real mother is just plain impossible."

So are Light Sabers.
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Offline Jedidz23

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Re: Post your ROTS reviews and thoughts!
« Reply #64 on: May 22, 2005, 04:18 PM »
"No, Leia remembering her real mother is just plain impossible."

So are Light Sabers.

Exactly.  None if this is possible.  However, it is a powerful narrative, and part of the beauty of the narrative is that while much of the informtaion is there on screen, some of it is left to the imagination of the audience.  That is much more effective to me.  I think Lucas has done a pretty good job of wrapping everything up nicely. 

I think it absolutely makes sense, as far as Leia being strong in the Force, but having no idea whatsoever as to how to harness her power.  Maybe the script in Empire doesn't have Luke or Leia knowing that they are siblings, but that doesn't mean she couldn't be more receptive to Luke sending her Force telpathic signals (as fas as where to go and pick him up) than someone else.  The intensity of emotion during the birth of the twins, and having Obi-Wan and Yoda present may have increased Force energy, and allowed Leia to get a sense of her mother.

Is this a stetch?  Absolutely it is, but so are talking robots, laser swords, Jedi Knigts with super powers, and casting terrible child actors to play a youthful Vader (Episode I).  I think Lucas may have been off on a lot of things concerning the first two prequels, but I think he nailed it with Revenge of the Sith.
« Last Edit: May 22, 2005, 04:22 PM by Jedidz23 »

Offline Jedidz23

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Re: Post your ROTS reviews and thoughts!
« Reply #65 on: May 22, 2005, 04:23 PM »
What became of the Sypho Dias mystery- ah, nothing?

I would sure like to know this as well.  Maybe it was Dooku using Dias's name as an alias.  That's what I always assumed.

Offline Jedidz23

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Re: Post your ROTS reviews and thoughts!
« Reply #66 on: May 22, 2005, 04:24 PM »
It is so over the top, those Clonetroopers blasting away, just to make sure she's dead.

I thought that was just to show brutality and an absolute lack of respect for the Jedi, as well as for life.

You should never laugh when someone that hot goes away dude.   ;)
« Last Edit: May 22, 2005, 04:25 PM by Jedidz23 »

Offline speedermike

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Re: Post your ROTS reviews and thoughts!
« Reply #67 on: May 22, 2005, 09:32 PM »
 "None if this is possible."   Your post was well said Jedidz23.   I am sick and tired of fans who think that they can decide which elements of fantasy are acceptable, and which aren't.

It is so insane to "believe" in the Force, yet not "believe" that in infant (in a fictional reality) can have a memory.  I'm all for talking about weak elements in the movies, and in the prequels there are many, but I have always accepted Lucas' word as gospel.  If he says that Leia remembers her mother, than she does.

Who knows, maybe the people who find these  flaws are the same people who consider the books, games, and comics to be more interesting than the movies.
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Offline Jesse James

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Re: Post your ROTS reviews and thoughts!
« Reply #68 on: May 23, 2005, 12:53 AM »
I actually agree with Jedidz23's opinion on how Leia can remember her mother though it seems impossible...  I view it as a force thing mostly.  Potentially a difference in the way the two children are raised, or things they're told during childhood, form the visions they have through the force...

But to me the explanation that first came to my mind (and which I offered my buddy tonight who surprisingly cited the Leia flaw right away, he impressed me being a more casual fan :) ) was that Leia's having sort of "dreams" she perceives as reality/memory of her mother...  I don't take that as grasping at straws since my mind didn't even stretch to come up with an excuse, but rather that came right to me when my buddy asked about that.  Why Luke doesn't have a memory...  I suppose anything from the focus of his thoughts to the focus of his life in general could've had an effect on that.  Luke only asks about their mother after he's seemingly had some time to reflect on who he was told his father was...  Maybe Luke's lack of thought towards his family (since his Uncle had put something else in his mind) made him lose memory of her?  Lose the connection that Leia perhaps retains because maybe Bail/wife raised her with more talk of Padme...  Who knows. 

It's one of those loose-ends I'm sorta sad that the movie didn't tie off...  That, the Qui-Gon thing, etc...  There definitely was room for another hour's worth of footage.  I feel that way about very little around the prequals. ROTS really won me.

The classic trilogy had me wanting more...  AOTC only had me wanting more about the war, maybe a tie-in space battle (Such a missing aspect of these 3 films), but ROTS I could've sat through another hour of just MORE.  :)  After 3 screenings I'm set for a 4th with anticipation.  Just hearing my buddies walk out with me tonight (Casual fans, but not die-hards who have to be at premieres or collect anything) and they're raving about the movie...  That felt great.  Guys that usually were critical of the films were now asking me questions, and actually discussing stuff with me without making fun of SW in its current state.  That rocked.
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Offline speedermike

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Re: Post your ROTS reviews and thoughts!
« Reply #69 on: May 23, 2005, 06:58 AM »
While I never expected  Lucas to explian everything, I too would have like to have seen Qui-Gon.  It would have tied TPM and ROTS together in a more visual way. I was hoping he would have appeared very briefly on the Blockade Runner, and he would have had Yoda's dialog about "more training."

It was the one thing in ROTS that wasn't good storytelling.  We were told something, as opposed to seeing it.
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Offline Darth Broem

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Re: Post your ROTS reviews and thoughts!
« Reply #70 on: May 23, 2005, 07:59 AM »
What Lucas should have had Padme do was to grab baby Leia and put her hand on her head.  Then spread her index and middle finger apart from her ring finger and pinkie and say "Remember!" just like Spock did to Dr. McCoy (is that his name?) during the end of the Wrath of Kahn. 

Everyone would have been satisfied with that :)

Offline Jedidz23

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Re: Post your ROTS reviews and thoughts!
« Reply #71 on: May 23, 2005, 10:17 AM »
"None if this is possible."   Your post was well said Jedidz23.   I am sick and tired of fans who think that they can decide which elements of fantasy are acceptable, and which aren't.

It is so insane to "believe" in the Force, yet not "believe" that in infant (in a fictional reality) can have a memory.  I'm all for talking about weak elements in the movies, and in the prequels there are many, but I have always accepted Lucas' word as gospel.  If he says that Leia remembers her mother, than she does.

Who knows, maybe the people who find these  flaws are the same people who consider the books, games, and comics to be more interesting than the movies.

I know what you mean, speedermike!  Thanks for the props, by the way.  :)

Some people can find fault in anything.  They are not going to be happy unless it's their way.  Oh well; don't let it affect your enjoyment of the film.  It is such a powerful movie!

Offline Jedidz23

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Re: Post your ROTS reviews and thoughts!
« Reply #72 on: May 23, 2005, 10:26 AM »
I actually agree with Jedidz23's opinion on how Leia can remember her mother though it seems impossible...  I view it as a force thing mostly.  Potentially a difference in the way the two children are raised, or things they're told during childhood, form the visions they have through the force...

Totally.  How they focus affects what the Force "broadcasts" to them.

But to me the explanation that first came to my mind (and which I offered my buddy tonight who surprisingly cited the Leia flaw right away, he impressed me being a more casual fan :) ) was that Leia's having sort of "dreams" she perceives as reality/memory of her mother... I don't take that as grasping at straws since my mind didn't even stretch to come up with an excuse, but rather that came right to me when my buddy asked about that. Why Luke doesn't have a memory... I suppose anything from the focus of his thoughts to the focus of his life in general could've had an effect on that. Luke only asks about their mother after he's seemingly had some time to reflect on who he was told his father was... Maybe Luke's lack of thought towards his family (since his Uncle had put something else in his mind) made him lose memory of her? Lose the connection that Leia perhaps retains because maybe Bail/wife raised her with more talk of Padme... Who knows.

I like this as well.  Good to know there are some people out there who will give star Wars credit, instead of instantly ridiculing.  It is far easier to criticize than it is to compliment.

It's one of those loose-ends I'm sorta sad that the movie didn't tie off... That, the Qui-Gon thing, etc... There definitely was room for another hour's worth of footage. I feel that way about very little around the prequals. ROTS really won me.

Both of those things would have been nice to be tied up, but I kind of liked that they weren't.  Similar to the gaps in time between Episodes IV and V, and V and VI, respectively.  We never saw the Rebels move to Hoth, we never saw the confrontation with the bounty hunter on Ord Mandell, and we never saw how Vader discovered that a farm boy by the name of Luke Skywalker blew up the Death Star.  In the same fashion, we never saw Lando infiltrate Jabba's palace, never saw Luke build his Lightsaber or continue with his training, and never witnessed how Leia got her Boush disguise.  Heck, how did they track down Jabba at all?  This is where the genius of Lucas as a storyteller is revealed; he lets the audience fill in some of the gaps with their imagination.  What a refreshing twist in our spoon-fed society!
« Last Edit: May 23, 2005, 10:29 AM by Jedidz23 »

Offline Jedidz23

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Re: Post your ROTS reviews and thoughts!
« Reply #73 on: May 23, 2005, 10:34 AM »
The classic trilogy had me wanting more...  AOTC only had me wanting more about the war, maybe a tie-in space battle (Such a missing aspect of these 3 films), but ROTS I could've sat through another hour of just MORE.  :)  After 3 screenings I'm set for a 4th with anticipation.  Just hearing my buddies walk out with me tonight (Casual fans, but not die-hards who have to be at premieres or collect anything) and they're raving about the movie...  That felt great.  Guys that usually were critical of the films were now asking me questions, and actually discussing stuff with me without making fun of SW in its current state.  That rocked.

Jesse, your post was so rich with good points, that I just have to piggy back on it some more!    ;D  Great points about wanting more.  I actually (for the first time in the history of Lucas fandom!) am looking forward to deleted scenes!  God help me, what have I become?   ;)  How cool that people actually wanted to talk about Star Wars instead of making fun of it!  I had a simillar experience with some members of my family.  Instead of complaining about the acting, or how much it wasn't like the originals, they talked about how cool the movie was, and we went out to eat and talked about Star Wars in a positive way!  It was great!

Offline Jedidz23

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Re: Post your ROTS reviews and thoughts!
« Reply #74 on: May 23, 2005, 10:35 AM »
What Lucas should have had Padme do was to grab baby Leia and put her hand on her head.  Then spread her index and middle finger apart from her ring finger and pinkie and say "Remember!" just like Spock did to Dr. McCoy (is that his name?) during the end of the Wrath of Kahn. 

Everyone would have been satisfied with that :)

Ha!  Nice one Brian!  You goof!  :)