Author Topic: Anakin's Immaculate Conception, Not So Holy?  (Read 4243 times)

Offline LandotheScoundrel

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Re: Anakin's Immaculate Conception, Not So Holy?
« Reply #15 on: May 23, 2005, 11:18 AM »
Well, there's also something to Palpatine being destroyed by his own creation.
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Offline Scott

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Re: Anakin's Immaculate Conception, Not So Holy?
« Reply #16 on: May 23, 2005, 02:07 PM »
I just don't buy it...I think it was the Force and not Palpatine...I can be proved all I want to from EU

Offline Taminar

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Re: Anakin's Immaculate Conception, Not So Holy?
« Reply #17 on: May 23, 2005, 02:27 PM »
My husband has speculated from the very beginning that Palpatine had something to do with Anakin's birth.  So, when the opera scene came about, it seemed obvious that yes, Palpy learned Plageis' secret and created Anakin.

I have seen a couple of pretty compelling arguments here that are variations on that, but I think if an early draft spelled it all out, I'm going to stick with the Palpatine created Anakin scenario.

I, too, had wondered if Palpatine arranged Shmi's death and influenced the visions of Padmé's death as well.

Maybe the reason George didn't make it all clear in his script is to give us all fodder on these forums! :)
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Offline Nicklab

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Re: Anakin's Immaculate Conception, Not So Holy?
« Reply #18 on: May 23, 2005, 02:46 PM »
I think all of the theories have credence.  There is one more that has to be considered:  Palpatine is a liar.  The ways of the Sith are betrayal and treachery, and I have no doubt that lying is not beneath the Sith.

I think it's very possible that Palpatine came to know of Anakin's immaculate conception.  Anakin told him about the Tusken Raider massacre, so it's a fair bet that Anakin told him about the mystery of his birth as well.

Palpatine may have used this information to manipulate Anakin.  He referred to him as "son" on one ocassion and has acted as a father figure to Anakin ever since the end of The Phantom Menace.  Add in the story of Darth Plagueis and it's evident that Palpatine is playing Anakin on a number of fronts.  The truth could be that Anakin's conception was in fact the will of the force, but Palpatine may be leading Anakin to believe that the Sith had something to do with his birth.

I just count this as one of a few possibilities.  This is going to be big-time EU story fodder.  Hopefully if this story gets told, Lucas will have one of the more high profile EU authors address this.
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Offline Scott

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Re: Anakin's Immaculate Conception, Not So Holy?
« Reply #19 on: May 23, 2005, 02:50 PM »
Ooh, whoever wrote Darth Maul:Shadow Hunter would be a fine choice! :P

I hadn't thought of the liar aspect, good theory Nick

Offline Darth Kenobi

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Re: Anakin's Immaculate Conception, Not So Holy?
« Reply #20 on: May 23, 2005, 02:54 PM »
I think like some of you Palpatine created Anakin, one of the main reasons is because of Lucas method of using some of the same concepts from the OT in the PT.  As far as Anakin being the choosen it would still hold true even eith Palpatine creating him.  As Yoda says in Sith a" porpohcey misread maybe" (or something like that) so the choosen one may not nessceary need to be created in a rightous way and could of been infulence by the darkside.  In the end we see that Anakin is in fact the choosen one since he offs Palpatine in the end of ROTJ.  
Just my 2 cents.

Offline Jesse James

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Re: Anakin's Immaculate Conception, Not So Holy?
« Reply #21 on: May 23, 2005, 05:47 PM »
I just don't buy it...I think it was the Force and not Palpatine...I can be proved all I want to from EU

I'm so far with you on this Scott.  Till I see otherwise, I'm guessing it's merely another attempt to pull puppet strings, and that Vader is likely the chosen one, the prophecy just isn't playing out as expected.  It ain't no fairy tale ending in this one.

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Offline Jedidz23

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Re: Anakin's Immaculate Conception, Not So Holy?
« Reply #22 on: May 23, 2005, 11:14 PM »
Personally, I think Lucas left it ambiguous on purpose (This is mentioned in this weeks Entertainment Weekly by the way; check it out). I am hoping that, even though it's weird, Sidious took what Plagus (sp?) taught him, killed Plagus, and created Anakin. As ridiculous as that seems, it is much better than an Immaculate conception!   

Offline Theyrenotdolls

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Re: Anakin's Immaculate Conception, Not So Holy?
« Reply #23 on: May 23, 2005, 11:27 PM »
I like both ideas about palpy or plagy creating anakin.  I think it's more likely that nick is right.  In the new insider, ian mcdirmiad (sp?) says that palpy, in the opera scene is just throwing a bunch of things at anakin, to see which one he'll bite on. 
I also agree with above that said it is probably meant to be ambiguous....but the seeds of thought have been planted...in anakin and in us. 


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Offline CorranHorn

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Re: Anakin's Immaculate Conception, Not So Holy?
« Reply #24 on: May 24, 2005, 02:07 AM »
some good theories all around, though I definitely like Nicklab's take on it, that Palpatine is just lying as part of his attempts to mainpulate Anakin.

While it does certainly fit the ways of the Sith, i think from an overall story pov, Palpy creating Anakin helps flesh things out more. It shows his evil machinations started way back when and it all culminates to the end of ROTS. just my view on it though, certainly some interesting other takes though.

Offline Theyrenotdolls

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Re: Anakin's Immaculate Conception, Not So Holy?
« Reply #25 on: May 24, 2005, 09:57 AM »
i agree corr,  i actually like the plagus spin a bit more, but either way i dont think palpatine cares if anakin bites on that hook or one of the others....he clearly was prepared for this encounter. 
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Offline Rob

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Re: Anakin's Immaculate Conception, Not So Holy?
« Reply #26 on: May 24, 2005, 04:38 PM »
I'm going with Palpy as the father.  I've been saying it since EI and they left it open enough that the implication is strongly there.

Very cool to get some of Palpatine's backstory - even if it's just him talking and it could all be B.S.  I just didn't read it as B.S.

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Re: Anakin's Immaculate Conception, Not So Holy?
« Reply #27 on: May 24, 2005, 05:24 PM »
I certainly like the idea of Anakin's birth being a human, evil or otherwise, manipulated event over the idea of him being conceived by the "will" of the Force itself.

Regarding Palpatine's backstory, he finishes off the Sith Lord story with such evil glee that when he explains the Sith Lord's ironic death, he appears so visibly pleased that it's hard to not take the story as the truth. In my mind, I think it's not BS.

I think it is a wonderful moment in the movie for consisting of the two elements that Lucas is criticized for being so bad at - crafting compelling dialog and directing actors to deliver it.

Offline Rob

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Re: Anakin's Immaculate Conception, Not So Holy?
« Reply #28 on: May 24, 2005, 07:35 PM »
I certainly like the idea of Anakin's birth being a human, evil or otherwise, manipulated event over the idea of him being conceived by the "will" of the Force itself.

The fact that such an unnatural birth would backfire on Palpatine and infact bring balance to the force after Vader kills the Emperor WOULD suggest that even the evil human event was the 'will' of the force itself.

Offline Darth_Anton

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Re: Anakin's Immaculate Conception, Not So Holy?
« Reply #29 on: May 24, 2005, 08:50 PM »
I like the idea that the sith could have created Anakin. Sure he was created by the force, but someone useing the force to do it fuels a lot of ideas and possibilities. It's way more fun to entertain ideas like that rather than reduce the idea to simple leverage to seduce Anakin. Besides, why would Anakin care about that if the immaculate conception didn't have relevance to him?

Either way, it's a brilliant idea. Look at all the debate.
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