JediDefender.com Forums
Community => Watto's Junk Yard => Topic started by: GrandMoffNick on May 21, 2018, 10:17 PM
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I start this thread possibly just as my vent thread.
I am trying so hard not to let others ruin my enjoyment of Star Wars but it's getting more and more difficult.
So tired of the "original" fans BS. If you hate it so much go back to when only the OT existed. There was no internet. So you can stay off of it
You don't have to like all of it. But stop being so high and mighty about it. If you're boycotting the rest of the Disney movies can't you boycott your obnoxious rants too?
Ugh
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Amen to this. 😐
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It does take an excessive amount of energy to hate something so vigorously. Do these "originals" think they're actually going to persuade people to see things from their POV?
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I don't get out to other sites and have been staying away from big media as it relates to Solo to avoid spoilers. Who / what site is getting their undies in a bunch that is getting you fired up Nick?
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I avoid most other sites too. But I used to enjoy Yakface. But reading the comments on the front page stories now is getting to me. Am I overreacting a bit? Probably. I do that. But seriously, if you can't separate your love of the OT from your hate of Disney Star Wars then I feel sad for you.
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I'll have to take a look.
In general I would say I don't hate the "Disney stuff" any more than the prequels and animation projects that Lucas did.
Did I love TLJ? No. But I've rewatched TFA and RO a hell of a lot more than TPM, and really enjoy those two movies.
I'm not gonna love everything that Disney does, and will sometimes think its kinda crappy (TLJ), but I don't think that is any different than the way I feel about George's stuff. Some good, some not as good.
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If you hate everything Disney has it's name on then that is fine. It's all opinion. Disney loves to make a quick buck. But why then is your reaction to hop on sites dedicated to this universe we love and go on and on and on about how terrible it is and how "now I'm embarrassed about being known as the Star Wars guy with the people I know".
I've said it before and I'll say it again. Hasbro or whoever would not be producing product after product from the OT in 2018 if the PT and now Disney Star Wars didn't exist. You're only getting a nicely updated Yakface because Star Wars has evolved. Moloch is not taking a spot for an OT character fig. He's why they can produce a nice Hoth Leia in 2018.
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May I suggest also to Jayson or Justin, if you read this first, deny my application for Yakface site membership.
And I want to make sure it's clear I'm annoyed with random people who in this case are commenting on Yakface. I mean nothing disparaging about the site. I'm amazed at the news you guys break and your knowledge.
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But I used to enjoy Yakface.
I recently notice backlash on their Facebook page regarding the movies a few weeks back and that was really the first time I ever saw that en masse. It felt like people from a different site (one that likes to poke fun at midwesterners and Minnesotans) flooded yakface FB with their hate and vitriol. But I haven't seen it in the threads (of actual members). I believe in the front page stories anyone can chime in via discus or anonymous log in without actually being a Yakface member.
But I agree with you, Nick. These are just movies, books, toys, etc. Enjoy the thing you like and don't worry about that which you don't. Life will be happier for people if they do.
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REY IS A MARY SUE! CHINESE WOMEN CAN'T KISS BLACK MEN! ADMIRAL PURPLE HAIR IS A STUPID **** AND UNFIT FOR MILITARY COMMAND! JJ ABRAMS' FAVORITE KEYS ON A KEYBOARD ARE CTRL, C, AND V! THAT CASINO WAS TOO MUCH LIKE THE PREQUELS! Okay I think that's most of the TLJ complaints :P
The Disney films have been far from perfect, and I sure have had both my likes and dislikes about them. But some of the stuff these "purists" are complaining about is just ridiculous. The entire point of TLJ was to train fans to let go, and most refuse to do so.
If you hate everything Disney has it's name on then that is fine. It's all opinion. Disney loves to make a quick buck. But why then is your reaction to hop on sites dedicated to this universe we love and go on and on and on about how terrible it is and how "now I'm embarrassed about being known as the Star Wars guy with the people I know".
I quit watching pro wrestling a few years ago but still frequent some of the sites since I have made good "friends" with other posters. Every week, it's the same thing; show airs Monday night, everyone says it's the worst episode ever, why can't it be as good as it was 20 years ago, people vowing to stop watching forever. Then the next week it's the same people watching and complaining, and spending the rest of the week talking about how much the show sucks. This is what the Star Wars/Disney hatred stuff reminds me of. If it's so bad, why continue to watch? Turn the TV and computer off and go for a walk; you might find a new hobby in the process.
Sidenote, I do love how the Prequels are now well regarded thanks to memes, and children who grew up with them entering the world of the Internet.
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I'm glad other people are noticing this as well. As said, everyone has a right to their opinion, I just don't get the anger and hatred about it. Personally, I've enjoyed the Disney era stuff just fine. It doesn't compare to the OT to me, and probably never could just due to the nostalgia factor - no matter how good a movie is. I've said it before, I just look at these blockbuster type movies like a ten year old "hey, they are making more movies of that thing that I love", and I look forward to each and every one. Plus, my daughter absolutely loves the new stuff (Rey in particular), and I wouldn't trade the connection we have had with Star Wars for anything. And that was due to new material being made.
I made my peace long ago, during the prequels (which I like as well), that I'll always have "my" trilogy and nothing is going to change that. I'm happy that kids today get their own as well. Plus we get bonus non-Saga movies, tv, cartoons, etc. I agree, I miss the times when we were a much more agreeable abd happy lot. Sure, Internet "nerd" fandom has always been a surly bunch, but with the prevalence of social media and comments sections in the Disney era - things have been taken to a new level. I also tire of the "no one asked for this" comments, primarily directed at Solo but to some extent Rogue One and the other stuff. Just sit back and try to enjoy things, or skip it if it isn't your jam. I see this more and more throughout movies, not just Star Wars. We see it in any remake/reboot of something we grew up on. We can still love those things even if they make new ones.
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Meh....I don't really give a crap about other peoples' opinions. (Present company excepted of course.)
I consider the OT "my trilogy", mainly because I was 6 years old when Star Wars came out in 1977. Other than a few odd choices and lack of quality control, I liked the SEs, but Star Wars: Revisited is the only way I'll watch the original movie now....I consider it the ultimate version of the film.
I enjoyed the PT for the most part, with ROTS being the best of the bunch, but it is painfully obvious that George Lucas had surrounded himself with people who were unwilling to tell him no and his shortcomings as a director are very easy to see. How the hell could he not get a better performance out of Ewan McGregor and Natalie Portman?
The real treat for me with the Disney era films has been watching them in the theater with my two boys. Jar Jar Abrams is not a good storyteller (he relies way too much on the mystery box), but he can create some of the most amazing visuals! (I still am in awe of the establishing shot of Jakku with the crashed Star Destroyer.) I thought Rian Johnson did a fine job with TLJ and truly enjoy the film....it's only line of dialog away from being the best of the new era.
Also, as far as the anthology films go, Rogue One is the best Star Wars film Disney has made so far. Take out Porkins lite Red 5 and the Evizan/Walrus man cameo and I would have a debate about it being a masterpiece of a film. While I don't think I would've gone with a young Han Solo film....the trailers have me interested. I have my tickets for this weekend, and my boys will be happy to see Star Wars and eat popcorn. Overall, I feel the Anthology movies are a gold mine for Disney, but they need to take risks and get away from the main characters.
Apologies if this was too hateful. ;D
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I certainly like the sequels better than the prequels. The only problem is that it seems they are making this up as they go and don't have an overall vision for the three movies. I would bet that things in TLJ would have been quite different if JJ was doing all three movies. I can understand the hate for Rose, not because she is Asian, but because she is a bad character. She really wasn't needed. I really didn't like the forced psuedo love triangle that was put into the movie. The numbered films are supposed to the Skywalker's story. I can understand the whole "let it go" thing and moving on, but who knows if we will see an Episode X and beyond. Really, the easy and obvious storyline would have been to make Rey Luke's daughter and continue the story through her. You can still kill off the big three and pass the torch, but you still make the story of the Skywalker family. I think Rian Johnson was a bit hamfisted with the "anyone can be a Jedi" thing. I think we already knew that since the prequels had maybe one or two non-Skywalker Jedi in them.
As for the anthology films, most of the prequels should have been the Clone Wars equivalent of the Battle of Scariff. For those of us who grew up with the OT, we always wanted to know about the Clone Wars that Obi-wan spoke about. In the PT, we get one movie of little Anakin that has little to do with the Clone Wars. Essentially, that movie could have been 10-15 mins. Then when we finally get to see the Clone army come into existence, we get about 10 minutes of the Clone Wars, and only the opening battle. When we get to the final prequel, the Clone Wars are essentially over. I'm fine with the Clone Wars cartoon, but I would have rather seen that type of action on the big screen instead of the boredom of TPM and AOTC.
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May I suggest also to Jayson or Justin, if you read this first, deny my application for Yakface site membership.
And I want to make sure it's clear I'm annoyed with random people who in this case are commenting on Yakface. I mean nothing disparaging about the site. I'm amazed at the news you guys break and your knowledge.
Sorry Nick, I can't stand 99.9% of the comments either but other than removing the commenting functionality altogether, it seems like nearly every article spirals into some love/hate Star Wars dick measuring contest. I hope you continue to visit for the articles/content/info more than the commentary because I make a concerted effort NOT to post clickbait articles (unlike other "collecting" sites) that, through their publication, encourage the vitrol and personal sniping that comes with them.
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For sure. If I was a smart man I'd read your post and just avoid the comments.
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it seems like nearly every article spirals into some love/hate Star Wars dick measuring contest
Pretty much. I get emails all the time asking for the ability to comment on front page articles here at JediDefender and I have ZERO interest in allowing the 'love/hate dick measuring' like Jayson called it. It's too easy for anyone with a Disqus account to come along and **** all over everything on a whim.
I know it's old school and it costs us a lot of advertising clicks (and potential revenue), but we will probably maintain our separate old-school forum here until this site dies.
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Thank you for that, Jeff. That's why Id rather spend my time around here over any of the other fan sites. I do like Yakface a lot too, but get most of their scoops from the Twitter feed so I can avoid those kinds of douchey comments.
It's hard to escape though, I play the SW Galaxy of Heroes app a lot and even in there people are always posting stupid things in the Guild chats like BOYCOTT SOLO or FIRE KATHLEEN KENNEDY, etc.
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For sure. If I was a smart man I'd read your post and just avoid the comments.
That’s what I do. Jayson is doing some fantastic reporting. But it seems that a lot of sites that have the Disqus comment option are having problems with people turning those comments sections into full blown dumpster fires. So I just cannot be bothered with Disqus in general.
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The don't see the movie opening weekend to show Kathleen Kennedy is one of my new personal favorites.
I also like the "OT fan embargo". Please don't lump me in your asinine nonsense. I'm an OT fan and am embargoing nothing
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Exactly. I’m 40. I like what Disney is doing and I’ve collected since the vintage weren’t vintage. Do not assume your microcosm of dip**** friends = “everyone” who likes the OT. I think most of these people just live in a bubble and you can’t argue with them... so why do they insist on engaging the rest of us who just take every movie as it comes, and enjoy (or not) each film and just wait on the next one? I don’t wanna argue why you should like it when you don’t so why remind me you don’t? Just leave the hobby and the series!
None of us even want to convince these people to come back! It’s more seat space for the rest of us! Feel free to not engage. Your point of dislike is clear. The only reply to it is “ok”.
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Like Dave, I'm pretty sheltered and pretty much just go to JD for my SW news, so hadn't heard about any of this until today. Its unfortunate, but it is what it is I guess. I think almost everything from Disney has been better than almost everything from the prequels, so I can't relate to all the hate. Its not always my favorite and I'm not known for being shy about stuff I don't like, but there's no reason to full on hate any of this stuff. I loved TFA and RO, and even TLJ had its moments.
I honestly think this is more of a function of the times and people's ability to criticize or hate from the comfort and anonymity of their little corner in the basement. For small minded people who have no other outlet for their frustrations, the internet is a safe zone where they can beat up on something else to distract them from something they hate about their own life. Its really sad if you think about it - someone is dedicating their precious time to go to a Star Wars website to complain about how much they don't like Star Wars and make others feel bad about it. ::) Life's too short for that nonsense.
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It IS pathetic that every page/ad what-not for recent movies gets attacked.
"They should burn every copy of TLJ."
"Mary Sue this."
"I hate Rose."
"Vice Admiral Gender Studies" What?!
These complainers aren't Star Wars fans. They don't get the subtle message that is put out there about acceptance of differences (cantina, rebellion, senate, Han/Chewie).
But hey, let's blame Kathleen Kennedy for one's own insecurities.
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Justin's take on TLJ would be how I'd expect a rational Star Wars fan to react. You didn't love it. You had plenty of issues. You shared those issues and discussed/debated it online.
At no point did you decide Kathleen Kennedy needed to die or declare to never enjoy another Star Wars entity again.
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Exactly.
Basically if You kept coming into every topic On Star Wars (not even TLJ... it could be toys, Han Solo, any rumor of a future film whatever), and basically said “it’s too bad Disney ruined all of Star Wars with their SJW Agenda! The OT is the only real Star Wars!”, and you didn’t just say that one time but Every single thread or the comments below every ad or trailer... that’s basically what is going on on sites that have Disqust integrated in them, Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, Reddit... everything.
I posted on my twitter feed something just saying I found the background idea of a Solo character (a droid... I’m trying to be completely non spoilers vague here) to be funny. Some guy who didn’t even follow me, so he had to have actively been searching for the subject in some way, started in with Disney SJW Agenda, Star Wars is forever ruined, Lucas never did this, I don’t want messages in my Star Wars blah blah blah.
It’s often not even remotely articulate too. This guy at least had coherent thoughts even though I thought they were dumb. Usually it’s just blind hate without much logic applies and a whole lot of “I’m all for diversity BUT.......”, and whatever comes next just makes you sad that these are or were your peers.
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I have a sickness. I can't stay away. The particular person who posted the following is by far the most obnoxious of the group. I worry my head will explode soon if I don't let it go.
"Its really important to send Disney a message. Boycott this weekend will help to do that. And boycott Episode 9 altogether. Its good to see the fans come together for the right cause. The Rebel Alliance is back!"
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Unfortunately while I don’t think this stupidity is making a dent at all, I do think the saga has some fatigue, especially with close releases like this has been. It’s a shame too cuz it really was a fun film and I’m gonna definitely catch it again or maybe two more times.
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It can definitely be frustrating. Everyone has a right to their opinions of course, and everything that comes out isn't going to be for everyone. Personally, I've enjoyed all of the Disney movies so far (and really liked Solo), but nothing is going to replace the OT for me - probably regardless of how good it is - and I made my peace with that a long time ago. I do get frustrated with the bad attitude just going in about the new movies. I have friends who I got to know because of mutual Star Wars fandom, not to mention what you can read online, who had the attitude prior to TFA of "nope I'm not going to like it" with reasons ranging from "Disney", "nothing will be as good as Empire", "prequels", or "no one asked for this". It all seems silly to me, and I hate that some "fans" would take pleasure in a Star Wars movie failing, like with the lower than projected numbers for Solo. Personally I'd like to see sequels to Solo. I do think there were a number of factors, with Avengers and Deadpool still going strong and just five months since Last Jedi. The box office is more crowded than ever these days.
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"These are ours. You guys are just whiny little wannabes. It's our generation that you just keep wanting to copy."
I am officially saddened and embarrassed to be a 40 year old Star Wars fan
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Welcome aboard that feeling man. I def am an OT focused fan and stuff but the new stuff I’ve taken as it comes and it’s mostly been good to me. Unfortunately I think a lot of “this” is just the political climate we live in really.
I don’t feel any boycott has had much of an impact on Solo. I think mountains of bad press leading up to it, Star Wars fatigue to some degree, the competition it faces, and a little bit of a logjam of Star Wars films hurt it much much more. I think it’ll do ok longer term but the film was pretty awesome even if it winds up disappointing financially for Disney. I loved it and wanted a sequel pretty bad afterwards. 🤷♂️
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I think the May release date more than any "fan" boycott is what hurt Solo. We just had TLJ this past December. They should have pushed Solo to December. I think Disney had some "fear" of Avatar when it was supposed to come out this winter. They shouldn't have messed with their formula.
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Apparently Memorial Day weekend is just about the worst weekend to release a movie historically. I know in the old days Star Wars was always released in the week preceeding Memorial Day...
Although $85 million for Solo for the weekend I think was solidly below expectations. I think they were estimates that it would be about $110.
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I apologize if this has been discussed already.
I read a comment that I first dismissed but only because I don't feel this way. Then I thought more about it.
There are a lot of Star Wars fans who were kids when PT was released. Young adults now for ST. I'm sure they enjoyed the OT but maybe it's bottom of their list.
Now they don't care about a movie about how Han Solo got his start, etc........
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Ed and Dave I agree... I think this was a bad weekend and it was too close to December’s movie. I’d prefer them finding a time and sticking to it.
Nick I think that’s fair too. At least to some degree. I’m not sure it’s a solid notion because I think Nostalgia drove a lot of TFA for instance... I’d like to think the other factors played a major role but I think there is at least some truth there. And the “old fans” appear to make up the majority of the rampant bitching too... I am glad Solo wasn’t a terrible film and was really good in my view, but at the same time I feel like Star Wars def needs bigger gaps in film releases.
Not sure why the Marvel formula doesn’t seem to apply here quite as much.
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More Star Wars geeks are mental patients than comic book nerds are?
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Man, reading through some social media stuff today, and it seems like this topic has really blown up (again). Stuff between SW Action News and JTA, stuff between Chuck Wendig and Rebel Force Radio, and just comments back and forth all around. I hate to see SW fandom go this way. There have always been things that people don't necessarily like, whether it is ewoks, Jar Jar or prequels, but I don't ever remember it being this toxic. Some of it may be real world factors that fan the flames a bit. I wish people could just like what they like and not have to resort to hate and name calling to those who disagree. It doesn't matter when you became a fan, how big your collection is, or what your favorite movie is. It really is kind of ruining Star Wars fandom. I enjoy coming online to read everyone's thoughts and opinions on Star Wars stuff as a sense of community. Honestly, most of my "real world" friends don't have the deep fandom of Star Wars, so it is nice to share with those who do. It is too bad it has become such an us vs. them scenario.
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The most disillusioning thing is that we can't just disagree and discuss/debate it. It has to turn into an all out war. I never should have stepped out of my Jedi defender bubble. It's pretty cozy in here. I miss my ignorance
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Is there anyone on JD.com not seeing Solo because you didn't ask for this movie? I'm just curious.
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I am a huge Dark Forces/Jedi Knight game and storyline fan. I never asked for, nor did I want at first, a Rogue One story because I knew it would kinda blow up Katarn’s mission to get the Death Star plans and then it also fudged a part of XWing too which I love.
But I wound up loving it. It would take something epically bad for me to say I’m not going to watch it at all. I can’t see turning your back on Star Wars. Then again I look T this stuff from Disney as really just EU since Lucas isn’t making it. It’s like if new Middle Earth material comes out. How can you look at it as on the same level as Tolkien’s work unless you personally see or read it and you think it’s good enough for YOU and whatever your personal standard is.
A billionaire could’ve bought Star Wars from Lucas and shuttered it if he wanted. Disney just outbid the next company.... more or less.
I like what I like and don’t what doesn’t suit me and that’s it. It’s not the big deal people make it out to be. If you prefer old EU nobody told you to burn your books. If you hate The ST so be it...
At the same time I’ve seen normal conversations from ST fans and non fans and at some point it boils down to agree to disagree and move on. At its core is the fact that people who don’t like it can’t stop it from happening and people who do are just simply content. I don’t personally want to convince someone why I liked TLJ and they should too, but back to your original point GMNick, I also don’t want to talk about it with like minded people only to have a peppering of “TLJ sucks” “Rey is a Mary Sue” “Luke is ruined” and “#NotMyHanSolo” Forced into otherwise normal fun speculating analyzing comparing and commenting. 🤷♂️
I couldn’t start a topic on the war on mimban because some shitbags are gonna jump in. Can do that here of course but in social media or Disqus(t) or whatever, it’s just a mess of angry guys who can’t change the direction Star Wars is headed, don’t want to talk about what is done in the films as it stands, and just want to now basically **** on anyone else’s fun who is enjoying it. 🤷♂️
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That's one of the saddest things about all this. You better not dare think you can just have a civil conversation about something from the Disney era. Someone is out there waiting to pounce
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I've avoided posting in this thread and any general thread on Solo for this reason. I no longer enjoy fandom, on really any level. The discourse has become so toxic, and dishonest, that it doesn't serve to risk conversations about things you enjoy or didn't turning into opportunities for people with (in some cases) a moneyed interest in twisting the conversation toward negativity or very often, outright hatred. That's not the case here, obviously, but my passion to engage has been greatly diluted.
I approach things from my own experience as a fan, going back to the Starlite Drive in in 1978. I approach from it being a writer. As a creative person, I like to engage with the conversation in regards to the story and mechanics of it. I approach it from being a human being, living in a world that is bigger than me, and in which SW is only a small (ok, big) part. It seems to me the Paul Harrison's of our community and the other malcontents referenced before approach from an angle where they are the sole propeitors of a world that is so small it fits inside their closets or garages and in which they are the gatekeepers. Any one in charge of it - Kathleen Kennedy, JJ, RJ, George Lucas - are simply imposter kings meant to be taken down.
There is nothing healthy, and nothing worthwhile, in their behavior. It has so many intersections with larger concerns in our society that probably merit conversation, but this isn't the place. I love SW. I like what I like, don't like what I don't like, like Jesse said, and I want to have fun with it. If I can't, I won't. I also won't let people like Harrison get away with his behavior when it comes at the expense of our credibility and our integrity. We're better than him and we need to show people that SW and collecting isn't a gutter where bigotry and misogyny run the shop.
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Today's social media quagmire seemed to be a significant escalation. It seemed to stem from author Chuck Wendig engaging some of the "originals". Notably, on the topic that they had been harassing people who are creating Star Wars content: trolling them on social media, death threats, the works. Evidently, Jimmy Mac of the Rebel Forces Radio podcast took issue with that. And it got to the point where he was claiming "ownership" of the Star Wars franchise, stating that it was people like him who had carried Star Wars through the late 80's and up until the prequels. The ugliness of his message was disgusting. And I was really glad to see a good number of people shout him down for this sort of nonsense.
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I’m not a big podcast guy so I wasn’t even sure what was going on totally there Nick so thanks for clearing some of that up for me haha.
I don’t know that dude and stuff but I hear a LOT of “original fans” talk. As a dude who was collecting prior to a modern line existed, who had the WEG books as the EU, and who saw the films as a kid when they came out, I get so sick of people trying to say “well the old fans hate this Disney crap!”
No YOU hate it. Don’t lump me into your generalizations! But there is so much of that going on.
Likewise nobody cares if you hate it either. Leave the rest of us alone who aren’t obsessed with hating it or *gasp* maybe even like a lot of it.
The most normal conversations I’ve had with people who didn’t like TLJ were here for the most part and with CorranHorn (who’s also here) on Facebook. That has been it.🤷♂️
The Star Wars twitter account wished Kathleen Kennedy a happy birthday and the tweet had to be deleted because of the **** that was said in it. That is sad on a level that should just simply be embarrassing to everyone in it.
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The Star Wars twitter account wished Kathleen Kennedy a happy birthday and the tweet had to be deleted because of the **** that was said in it. That is sad on a level that should just simply be embarrassing to everyone in it.
I agree that the way people have treated Kathleen Kennedy is inexcusable. The people who have engaged in the vitriol need to just stop it. If they don't like the direction of the franchise?
Direct that negative energy elsewhere.
The one thing to note about that birthday message? Evidently the Star Wars social media team screwed up, because Kathleen Kennedy's birthday is actually tomorrow.
I feel very much the same about this "originals" crap. These guys really need to get over themselves and get some perspective. I was in the theaters when the movies came out, too. I can vividly remember each time I saw the OT in the theater. I remember my uncle actually taking out a 16mm copy of ANH from the local library and watching that at his house, projected on the wall. We even had VHS copies of ANH and TESB in the early 80's because we had VHS way back when and had bootleg copies. I watched those ENDLESSLY. And while I love the franchise, I don't feel this sense of.... ENTITLEMENT. I just don't get where that comes from.
Now maybe it's because I drifted away from Star Wars in large part from 1984 until the Special Editions came out in the mid 90's. FWIW, I liked the Special Editions of ANH and TESB. I didn't get worked up about the whole "Han shot first" thing. And because of scheduling issues I didn't even make it out to see the SE of ROTJ. I didn't really start collecting again until '98. And I didn't really get into the novels like the Thrawn trilogy that some of these guys said were keeping things alive before the TPM got the movies rolling again in 1999.
But since then I've been with the franchise through it all. I have taken the movies and tv projects for what they are. I like some more than others. But I have never felt like I have the standing to tell an author or filmmaker how they should be doing their job. Maybe my perspective is different because I'm engaged in creative avenues because I'm a musician, I have worked on original projects (songwriting, albums, etc) and I have respect for other artists? Creating something new is difficult: not everyone is going to like what you do. It's just the nature of art/writing/filmmaking, etc.
But this vocal minority has really gone too far. Especially with these delusions that would lead you to think that it was THEM that carried a property that was one of the most successful film franchises of all time. It makes this whole "originals" thing look like such nonsense.
Someone actually wrote up a meme and posted it to Twitter (https://twitter.com/bobbyrobertspdx/status/1003298983039516673), and it does seem to sum up the toxic state of fandom that has existed ever since George Lucas started releasing the prequel trilogy
FIRST...
You charge the guy with ruining your childhood
Then you never let him forget it.
(There's even a documentary!)
Then he sells his company
And you're like YES. MAYBE IT'LL BE GOOD AGAIN
(But you're also like NOW MICKEY MOUSE WILL JUST RUIN IT)
(Even though you just spent 10 years complaining about how ruined it is)
(And the "It" in question is a family film series about space wizards)
So the person he handpicked to run the studio starts running it
And she starts immediately making billions with well-received films
But there's too many girls
And it doesn't feel special to you anymore
So you don't like it
And you start talking about how
The old guy should come back.
Even though he likes the movies she's making
The ones he helped create before selling
(which you were happy about.)
And now you hate the woman
(when you're not erasing her by blaming a cartoon mouse)
For not being the guy
That you chased off
For ruining your childhood
AND THEN...
She makes another movie
And gets the star of the old guys's first big success to direct
And goes way overbudget making sure THAT guy sticks to the script
(unlike the guys she first hired)
(they're ALL guys, btw)
(The guys you didn't like UNITL she fired them for not sticking to the script)
The script about the guy's guy from his first movie
(the guy who lives in his car with his dog)
The script written by a father-son team
The father who helped write all the old guy's best movies
And she releases in on the annivery that
(apparently)
defines your childhoold
And it disappoints at the box-office
And you cheer
Because she gave you what you wanted
and you threw it on the ground
So because she catered to your specific tastes
(Whatever they are right now)
And those tastes weren't rewarded
She needs to quit
And they need to bring back the old guy
The one you hated 10 years ago
for ruining your childhood.
Which is apparently
Neverending...
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Thanks for posting that. That got me to laugh out loud
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Another quick question. Did I miss the press release or police report where George detailed being held at gun point or was blackmailed into selling Star Wars to Disney?
Maybe he had a script for stand alone Jar Jar movie Disney said they'd tell about it?
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But this vocal minority has really gone too far. Especially with these delusions that would lead you to think that it was THEM that carried a property that was one of the most successful film franchises of all time.
Exactly.
This is all playing out on a tiny corner of the internet. There are LEGIONS of Star Wars fans in the 'real world' who like Star Wars and have kept it alive without knowing about all these pod casts or you tubers or fan sites or whatever.
I've been on the internet doing "Star Wars" for over 20 year and there are plenty of these self-important "gate-keeper" fan sites and pod casts I've never heard of before. In the same way, I'm sure there are MILLIONS of Star Wars fans out there who have never heard of JediDefender. Star Wars fandom is a very large pool, no one person or group gets to call it theirs alone.
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Worst part is the victory lap these jerks are taking. Like an unsuccessful film is good for anything. Not to mention that their "revolt" or whatever you want to call it had little to do with this film's lack of box office performance.
I think this one was maligned with bad pub from the beginning. I really can't figure it out. People will say "releases too close" but tell that to Marvel who have 2 films over $1B in four months. It's too bad because the film was pretty good. Definitely a head-scratcher.
I like that in the JD community we may not always agree, but I don't feel like anyone's opinion is crapped on in a personal way. We can have a civil discussion about things. I think it's funny that TLJ is either the best thing ever or the worst. I think that most probably fall in the middle somewhere. I liked most of it, but it wasn't perfect. Nor was it worse than AotC. BUT it certainly is not worth all the hatred either way.
Honestly though, we have seen this since 99 with a greater and greater intensity. All the bashing that TPM took but it was still a monster success. People saw it multiple times. If something sucks hard, why see it over and over again? Then they started to extend the"crappy movie streak" back to RotJ. It's just laughable.
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Lol yeah “fans” ugh.
It’s ok not to like something. I don’t care for TPM or AotC these days. They’re meh. Lucas is still important in my life and always will be. The Canto Bight stuff in TLJ for me was meh, no worse or better than PT meh, and KK, RJ, and JJ ruined NOTHING about my life.
Health issues have ruined some aspects of my life. Losing someone has ruined something in my life. These movie issues have all been things I move on from.
If it’s “ruining” anything to you, you’ve got soul searching to do. You don’t have to like it but keep **** in perspective. Star Wars EU still exists. The original movies are still there like you remember them. These movies are as easy to ignore as they are to intricately pick apart. And if you’re mad because “SJW crap ruined Star Wars!”, I feel like you’re just hopeless. Letting that ruin something for you just is sad. :-\
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Feels like this is the right space to post this:
Mending your relationship with Star Wars (https://www.facebook.com/dorkly/videos/1956626844380716/)
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Pretty funny, although I never saw Rick and Morty so that one is over my head...
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Pretty funny, although I never saw Rick and Morty so that one is over my head...
You need to start binge watching Rick and Morty ASAP!
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http://yakfaceforums.com/main/2018/10/19/starwars-com-removes-fan-collecting-sites-section/
I find this humorous. Nice work "fans"
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How was Jedi Defender not on there???
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The ugliness from a number of outlets has grown to toxic proportions. And it's not limited to just one. I can think of collecting sites, podcasts and YouTube channels that have just gotten way out of control. Some of them seemingly have nothing positive to add to the franchise and have become more about promoting themselves and pushing forth some kind of anti Star Wars agenda. A move like this can be a case of addition by subtraction. And I am well aware that the PR firm Hasbro uses to communicate with SW fan sites has put some of them on notice because of their highly questionable conduct.
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I'm glad Disney/Lucasfilm are taking a stance on this issue and making some changes. Hopefully enough people will notice and there will be a shift in behavior among "fans". :-\
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It’s a freaking movie. Good grief.
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How was Jedi Defender not on there???
Considering we actually enjoyed Star Wars and didn’t incessantly **** on it, not really sure.🤔
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Btw by all means read down the Disqust comments to where a fellow named CG tried to engage a guy named Darth Sakul. Some classic reasons WHY all this is being done are displayed. That Sakul guy has some sand up his ass for sure. Censorship? If deleting sites that pushed bigotry and hate is censorship then I guess I’m suddenly not against censorship.
People act like THEY bought Star Wars... ::)
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Darth Sakul is why I no longer have a disqus account. It was the only way to keep myself from flipping out on the guy.
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There's one angle here that needs to be stated, and I hope that Lucasfilm looked into this thoughtfully. Because the element that I think LFL is trying to distance themselves from is very likely the same element that ran Kelly Marie Tran off of social media. I know that not everyone thought that Rose was a crucial character in TLJ. But the way KMT was treated by some of these so-called "fans" was disgusting. She's a human being, and she did not deserve any of that nonsense.
So if this move by LFL is in defense of their own people? I'm glad to see them doing that. And I also recognize that they're making this move while we're still about 6 or 7 months out from Celebration Chicago. LFL and Star Wars don't need these clowns hanging around and making that experience negative for the tens of thousands of people who go to Celebration.
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This post brought me back into Disqus
"BOYCOTT IX! Disney clearly does't care about star wars fans, they only care about their sjws and gays. I hope JewJew fails miserably and his movie is as much of a mess as the terrible VII and VIII. BOYCOTT IX!" - by Rebel the Hutt
I'm fuming right now. I hate people so much. We all suck
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A troll like that isn’t worth engaging. They just thrive on the negative attention.
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Yeah you are correct. Sometimes I don't have the self control though. Needless to say the post was quickly deleted by Jayson
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I’d be willing to bet he turns up elsewhere and posts with at best a slap on the wrist if not outright immunity because some sites just don’t want to punish those people because deep down they agree with them.
I didn’t like everything about 8... it’s ok to not like something in Star Wars and still like Star Wars, and not be a rampant shitbag. What is it about today’s society that lets everyone’s racist sexist homophobic freak flags fly, who largely kept that **** to themselves before? I understand if politicially you don’t like Disney (they don’t treat their employees well I’ve heard so I have my gripes wirh them too) but I mean just walk away if you literally hate the company that much because you feel they’re too far left... lots of us don’t give a **** and just like Star Wars, even with imperfect stuff in it.
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Jayson has been a great example of doing the right thing when it comes to what's been going on with fandom the past few months. And I appreciate him taking swift action to address bull**** like that.
But in light of this article (https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood/2018/10/the-last-jedi-russian-trolls) and the research study that inspired it (https://www.researchgate.net/publication/328006677_Weaponizing_the_haters_The_Last_Jedi_and_the_strategic_politicization_of_pop_culture_through_social_media_manipulation)? It calls into question a significant number of the online critics of The Last Jedi and the Star Wars franchise as a whole. And it's worth discussing that: Star Wars has brought together SO MANY people the whole world over. It's a tremendous unifier because of the some of the universal themes of the films. So it seems like an opportune target for people who are trying to sow division.
As for the so-called "fan" sites? Well, some people are just content to be ********.
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The entire KMT social media story is completely overblown. The same "people" who harassed her online is the same twitter account that the entire TFA black stormtrooper controversy 3 years ago. It's one twitter account with like 12 followers and some online site picks up a non-story that goes viral and no one does any read fact checking.
Kelly Marie Tran didn't have much of a social media presence until just before TLJ marketing kicked off. She used social media to promote the film then stopped again when the promotion for the film ended. She was not run off by bigoted fans.
Of course there's a vocal minority that are emboldened by the anonymity of the internet....but it's easy enough to ignore those idiots until people looking for clickbait get ahold of them.
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That's a bunch of ****. Be better than that, Matt. And if you're going to make a scurrilous claim like that, you had better be prepared to back it up with a source. Otherwise, talk like that sounds like a conspiracy theory.
Kelly Marie Tran: I Won’t Be Marginalized by Online Harassment (https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/21/movies/kelly-marie-tran.html)
By Kelly Marie Tran
Aug. 21, 2018
Editors’ note: The actress deleted her Instagram posts this summer in response to online harassment. Here she speaks out for the first time.
It wasn’t their words, it’s that I started to believe them.
Their words seemed to confirm what growing up as a woman and a person of color already taught me: that I belonged in margins and spaces, valid only as a minor character in their lives and stories.
And those words awakened something deep inside me — a feeling I thought I had grown out of. The same feeling I had when at 9, I stopped speaking Vietnamese altogether because I was tired of hearing other kids mock me. Or at 17, when at dinner with my white boyfriend and his family, I ordered a meal in perfect English, to the surprise of the waitress, who exclaimed, “Wow, it’s so cute that you have an exchange student!”
Their words reinforced a narrative I had heard my whole life: that I was “other,” that I didn’t belong, that I wasn’t good enough, simply because I wasn’t like them. And that feeling, I realize now, was, and is, shame, a shame for the things that made me different, a shame for the culture from which I came from. And to me, the most disappointing thing was that I felt it at all.
Because the same society that taught some people they were heroes, saviors, inheritors of the Manifest Destiny ideal, taught me I existed only in the background of their stories, doing their nails, diagnosing their illnesses, supporting their love interests — and perhaps the most damaging — waiting for them to rescue me.
And for a long time, I believed them.
I believed those words, those stories, carefully crafted by a society that was built to uphold the power of one type of person — one sex, one skin tone, one existence.
It reinforced within me rules that were written before I was born, rules that made my parents deem it necessary to abandon their real names and adopt American ones — Tony and Kay — so it was easier for others to pronounce, a literal erasure of culture that still has me aching to the core.
And as much as I hate to admit it, I started blaming myself. I thought, “Oh, maybe if I was thinner” or “Maybe if I grow out my hair” and, worst of all, “Maybe if I wasn’t Asian.” For months, I went down a spiral of self-hate, into the darkest recesses of my mind, places where I tore myself apart, where I put their words above my own self-worth.
And it was then that I realized I had been lied to.
I had been brainwashed into believing that my existence was limited to the boundaries of another person’s approval. I had been tricked into thinking that my body was not my own, that I was beautiful only if someone else believed it, regardless of my own opinion. I had been told and retold this by everyone: by the media, by Hollywood, by companies that profited from my insecurities, manipulating me so that I would buy their clothes, their makeup, their shoes, in order to fill a void that was perpetuated by them in the first place.
Yes, I have been lied to. We all have.
And it was in this realization that I felt a different shame — not a shame for who I was, but a shame for the world I grew up in. And a shame for how that world treats anyone who is different.
I am not the first person to have grown up this way. This is what it is to grow up as a person of color in a white-dominated world. This is what it is to be a woman in a society that has taught its daughters that we are worthy of love only if we are deemed attractive by its sons. This is the world I grew up in, but not the world I want to leave behind.
I want to live in a world where children of color don’t spend their entire adolescence wishing to be white. I want to live in a world where women are not subjected to scrutiny for their appearance, or their actions, or their general existence. I want to live in a world where people of all races, religions, socioeconomic classes, sexual orientations, gender identities and abilities are seen as what they have always been: human beings.
This is the world I want to live in. And this is the world that I will continue to work toward.
These are the thoughts that run through my head every time I pick up a script or a screenplay or a book. I know the opportunity given to me is rare. I know that I now belong to a small group of privileged people who get to tell stories for a living, stories that are heard and seen and digested by a world that for so long has tasted only one thing. I know how important that is. And I am not giving up.
You might know me as Kelly.
I am the first woman of color to have a leading role in a “Star Wars” movie.
I am the first Asian woman to appear on the cover of Vanity Fair.
My real name is Loan. And I am just getting started.
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Exciting day to see our first new figure from ROS. And I'm so happy the sad trolls get their chance to pounce.