JediDefender.com Forums
Collectibles => The Vintage Collection => Topic started by: Jeff on August 20, 2019, 10:01 AM
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Saw this story this morning...
Hasbro to Phase Out Plastic from New Toy and Game Packaging (https://investor.hasbro.com/news-releases/news-release-details/hasbro-phase-out-plastic-new-toy-and-game-packaging)
Hasbro "plans to begin phasing out plastic from new product packaging, including plastic elements like polybags, elastic bands, shrink wrap, window sheets and blister packs. The company’s ambition is to eliminate virtually all plastic in packaging for new products by the end of 2022."
I have lots of questions...
How do you have carded figures with no plastic/blister packs? ???
What does this mean for Black Series 6" window boxes? Open windows? Closed boxes where you can't see the figure's paint job? Some kind of 100% vegetable polyfilm (hat won't hold up over time) in the place of the plastic window?
Or maybe it's phrased "virtually all" so they can still use a little plastic for carded figures? Or maybe it won't matter because they already know they aren't renewing the Star Wars license in 2020 and don't need to worry about carded bubble/blister pack figures. :-X >:D
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Maybe it just means they're switching to a corn-based, biodegradable blister or something like that?
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****, can I finally just buy them loose? I'd be fine with that. I shudder to think how much landfill space I've taken with just my collection.
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****, can I finally just buy them loose? I'd be fine with that. I shudder to think how much landfill space I've taken with just my collection.
I'd be all about it if Hasbro Pulse wanted to offer a loose option for purchases. As long as the accessories and figures are there, I don't need any of the rest.
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Maybe it just means they're switching to a corn-based, biodegradable blister or something like that?
March 2018 Hasbro announced they were going to start using plant-based bio-polyethylene terephthalate (PET) for blister packs and plastic windows in its product packaging starting in 2019. (https://newsroom.hasbro.com/news-releases/news-release-details/hasbro-roll-out-plant-based-packaging) The bioPET plastic they are using is made with 30 percent plant-based material (ag waste).
It certainly could be that the current 30% plantblend PET is enough wiggle room to not be "plastic" and it's no change. That brings up a whole bunch of questions though - are plant-based PETs going to last as long? Will plant PET bubbles yellow/discolor faster over time? Will they degrade at a rate that makes carded collecting pointless? They might be great for the environment but are they great for collecting packaged toys?
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Judging from my local Walmarts and Targets, they're phasing out packaging by not offering any product for sale to begin with :P
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Judging from my local Walmarts and Targets, they're phasing out packaging by not offering any product for sale to begin with :P
+1
Seriously though, I think Hasbro already does a great job on the recycling / eco-friendly front. All of their plastic is recyclable and their packaging seems fairly minimal.
I compare that to things that Disney sources themselves (e.g. ToyBox figures) and most of that does not have recyclable plastic and seems to use a lot more packaging.
Its nice that they're striving for this, but yeah, it might mean keeping things carded in bio-plastic means your bubble isn't going to last more than 10 years. Maybe we're going to need vacuum sealed Star Cases now to keep the bubble from degrading.
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Interesting to see if that actually extends to the bubbles/Windows on current toys. I mean, they mention it, but is there an action figure out there that doesn't use that in some shape or form? I can't imagine basically buying things blind boxed all of the time. I mean, I love the vintage collection cardbacks, but outside of that I don't know that I care. Save the world, and minimize packaging. The face printing may take out some of the guesswork as to the quality of a figure, but there could still be errors/problems.
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is there an action figure out there that doesn't use that in some shape or form?
The closest thing I can think of are the Playskool Heroes (https://www.hasbro.com/common/productimages/en_US/FB055EFAD5CE4DFE8D9C49F687F8E7E6/0d43c27166547846aa8c43d3d1a120b1b6ad6139.jpg) and Imaginext (https://target.scene7.com/is/image/Target/GUEST_bfce65dd-77b4-4a1f-af56-18aa86647a96?fmt=webp&wid=1400&qlt=80) type stuff where there is a plastic tray but no bubble and things are just strapped on with ties.
Hasbro also had those cheapo international ~5.5" figures in little boxes with no plastic window/bubble in the packaging.
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With the rumors of the Triple Force Friday figure offerings consisting of 5" figures, a wave of Vintage Collection figures, and a wave of Black Series figures...it does make me wonder what we will see in the way of vehicles. I know there are some things rumored for the Galaxy of Adventures line, and two possible Vintage Collection vehicles (Luke's X-Wing?), but it would be strange if that was it. One of the main draws of the 3 3/4 scale in the first place was the ability to interact with vehicles and environments. But, at the same time, I can hardly remember a vehicle release since the Force Awakens that didn't get clearanced, so maybe they don't hold the interest of kids much anymore.
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Packaging will be made out of die-cast metal.
In terms of the future, Hasbro is like Disney with the movies
"We need a new generation of buyers to sell Star Wars to and we will either pretend that market exists or try to will it into being!"
But if such a market exists, unlike the sand people, they may not be back and probably not in greater numbers.
GEORGE SOLD YOU A LEMON AND YOU TRYIN' TA MAKE BLUE MILK. :P
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I've seen some people bring up the foreign (Japan?) boxed figures they had during the vintage era. Basically a cardboard box with a picture of the figure/character on the outside. It is funny how we have all this concern about paint apps, etc these days but in general it didn't seem to matter back then. Heck, even today if you are picking up vintage figures - aside from play wear things are pretty consistent overall. Simpler, of course, but very consistent from figure to figure outside of more intentional variations.
I really only collect carded with the vintage collection figures, and that is primarily OT ones (I also try to grab an extra of Han and Chewie each time they are released). I also feel that the Vintage Collection probably has a timer on it at this point to either end or be "rested" again. I love those cardbacks so much, but I don't know if they hold as much meaning to those who didn't grow up with them, and that is a slowly shrinking group. Other than that, I guess I could are less if they minimized packaging if it helped the environment or even lowered costs/prices somehow. I think the recent Black Series SDCC exclusives have essentially been plastic free, so we know it can work there. The 3 3/4" line might be more challenging, but it will be interesting to see what they come up with.
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Saw this story this morning...
Hasbro to Phase Out Plastic from New Toy and Game Packaging (https://investor.hasbro.com/news-releases/news-release-details/hasbro-phase-out-plastic-new-toy-and-game-packaging)
Hasbro "plans to begin phasing out plastic from new product packaging, including plastic elements like polybags, elastic bands, shrink wrap, window sheets and blister packs. The company’s ambition is to eliminate virtually all plastic in packaging for new products by the end of 2022."
I have lots of questions...
Going to drag this one up for discussion as it was a talking point during the latest Hasbro Quarterly Financial review. They shared an image for an example -
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E0EOrkoWYAYRr7-.jpg)
Still waiting to see what the future holds for "eliminating virtually all plastic" from Star Wars figure packaging and what type of impact that will have on boxed/packaged collectors going forward...
edit: I guess as a reminder of where Star Wars packaging stands, I should also add this Yakface link (https://yakfaceforums.com/main/2021/03/19/hasbro-survey-regarding-plastic-free-packaging-for-black-series/) where Jayson scooped some surveys Hasbro sent out about possible "no plastic" Black Series packages...
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I do commend Hasbro for their green efforts. I really do like that all of their current packaging is recyclable. When I open a pile of figures, nearly all of the packaging can go in to the recycling bin.
There are other manufacturers and lines that do not put this effort in. As an example I just opened a couple of Disney's ToyBox figures and the plastic used is not labeled as recyclable. I don't believe their Droid Factory figure packages have recyclable plastic either.
The only thing I worry about with eliminating plastic is how they'll keep all the small accessories/guns from getting lost/stolen. Hopefully they'll still rubber band / plastic tie down a bunch of these, but I hope this doesn't end up screwing with their accessory choice as it'll be hard to do small round things and secure them. Or maybe they'll put them in a cardboard box as part of the package and you just won't be able to see them.
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Maybe they're planning on plant based plastics instead of petroleum based plastics? Like, biodegradable still made out of corn?
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I do commend Hasbro for their green efforts. I really do like that all of their current packaging is recyclable.
True... but sadly most recycled plastic usually ends up in the trash anyway (https://www.npr.org/2020/09/11/897692090/how-big-oil-misled-the-public-into-believing-plastic-would-be-recycled).
Maybe they're planning on plant based plastics instead of petroleum based plastics? Like, biodegradable still made out of corn?
In 2018, they started using bioPET plastic that is 30% plant based (https://newsroom.hasbro.com/news-releases/news-release-details/hasbro-roll-out-plant-based-packaging) for bulbbles and windows. It'll be interesting to see if that is enough or not. It will also be interesting to see how those bioPET blends hold up over the long haul in collector's homes. Will all your carded TVC figures from 2018 turn yellow faster than other TVC figures?
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In 2018, they started using bioPET plastic that is 30% plant based (https://newsroom.hasbro.com/news-releases/news-release-details/hasbro-roll-out-plant-based-packaging) for bulbbles and windows. It'll be interesting to see if that is enough or not. It will also be interesting to see how those bioPET blends hold up over the long haul in collector's homes. Will all your carded TVC figures from 2018 turn yellow faster than other TVC figures?
One of a dozen reasons why I don't have any carded figures. :)
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Yeah, open those things!
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Yeah, open those things!
Get it out. Play with it. Let it breathe.
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Dragging this topic up from the depths to open discussion based on the past couple days on social media. In case you missed it, the days of having plastic bubbles and plastic insert trays are numbered in Star Wars toy packaging. From Yak-Face/Jayson:
Burstin the Bubble of Star Wars Collectibles and Collectors (https://yakfaceforums.com/main/2022/04/20/bursting-the-bubble-of-star-wars-collectibles-and-collectors/)
A reminder/history lesson on Hasbro's journey so far:
2013 - switched from polyvinyl chloride (PVC) to polyethylene terephthalate (PET), which is recyclable in most communities in USA
2016 - switched from new PET to post-consumer recycled PET (rPET)
2019 - switched from rPET to plant-based bio-polyethylene terephthalate (bioPET)
2022 - Introduction of "Virtually Plastic Free*" (*not counting tape or glue) packaging
So, thoughts? Where are you on the Kübler-Ross five stages of grief model?
- Denial: Hasbro can't be dumb enough to do this, can they?!?
- Anger: WTF Hasbro? I'm done with collecting!
- Bargaining: Does the PET in bubbles really matter if the whole toy is plastic?!?
- Depression: ****, this sucks. Is collecting even worth it anymore?
- Acceptance: I can't fight it so I may as well prepare for it.
Are you pissed that carded collecting as you know it is over? Are you ambivalent since the packaging is just garbage anyway?
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As an opener I am ok with this. The packing box and art, if I was inclined to keep, would be in better shape than card backs that had the bubble removed. And this packaging I know can be recycled, unlike the bubbles, which, from the wording on the website for my recycler, likely gets sorted out and put in the landfill.
The downside is not being able to see the paint application before I buy.
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Meh. A few years ago I might have been a lot more pissed off about this. Pre-pandemic I would find a figure with a good card, good bubble, and good paint job. There would be wear and tear from shipping to the store, stock-people cutting open boxes and handling and placing the figures on pegs, and other customers handling figures on the pegs before I got to them - so I wanted a good one.
These days its all pre-orders where I have no ability to control any of that and get what I get from Amazon/Target.com. I don't think I've purchased more than two figures at retail in the past two years.
I'll miss the 3.75" bubbles and the nostalgia of the form factor, but at the end of the day this doesn't really get me too upset. If I'm going to get upset about something with the figure line I'll spend my time bitching about the lack of truly new figures.
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If they go the plastic free route, then they will have to end the Vintage Collection and start calling the 3.75" line something else.
Whether you are a carded collector or not, part of this line being called the Vintage Collection is the packaging that is so reminiscent of the packaging from the original Kenner toys from 1977 - 1985.
They better damn well finish the original 96 since they promised they would.
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The only thing I wouldn't love about it is if I can't scope out the paint job before buying.
But I almost NEVER am buying something in a store with two sitting there to choose from anyway. So what do I care.
This is already a wasteful hobby in terms of pollution and resources compared to what it provides for humanity. If they can make it a little less wasteful, I'm in favor of it.
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I would argue that the plastic bubble on Kenner-inspired "expressions" are just as integral to the collectible being sold as the plastic figure inside. I would further argue that Hasbro knows this, having switched from those 3.75" Black Series WalMart boxed figures back to TVC cards.
The Retro 2-pack of Dengar and IG-88 has carded figures inside a larger box. The Marvel Legends Retro figures have done this multiple times. Hasbro has already found a technical out if they absolutely can't have visible bubbles for sale.
The bubbles are with us until TVC is done. And Retro for that matter. But look for new figures (with new tooling) to likely follow the form factor of the $25 Boba Fetts from earlier this year.
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I would argue that the plastic bubble on Kenner-inspired "expressions" are just as integral to the collectible being sold as the plastic figure inside.
Don't forget "ICONIC"!
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Isn't TVC a revolution in packaging compared to other toy lines? They should just do nothing and tout how revolutionary this design is. ;)
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As a person who opens 99% of my stuff, yeah I'm fine with it. I'm in the same boat as Dave. 5 years ago I may have been upset, but since everything I buy now is online I've gotten used to "you get what you get". Plus, without my reading glasses I can't see the bad paint apps anyway.
It sure is going to be a fun day on social media though when we get our first look at the 2023 TVC, Retro Collection, and ROTJ 40th Anniv 6" carded stuff with little cardboard boxes glued where the bubble should be. >:D
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A few years ago I’d have been disappointed. But I’m OK with not buying a second set to keep carded now, so that’s fine. Since it’s all preordered online anyway, maybe just a white cardboard box like the old mail-in figures is all that’s necessary.
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I've been seeing a lot of "the sky is falling" type of talk the past couple of days since the Hasbro Marvel Legends livestream. Mostly from the TVC community. So what do I *THINK* is going to happen?
Well, the no-name 6" budget figure line has already gone this route. They're in stores. I saw them myself. The figures are still trash. But it's a sign of things to come.
The Black Series? I think it's going to head in the direction of no plastic packaging. That line has been more adaptable to change. But I think the concern about the quality of paint apps is legitimate. And we've all seen the handiwork of swappers.
And then there's The Vintage Collection. The TVC deluxe line is new. And as a result I can understand Hasbro launching this new assortment with the all cardboard packaging. And I think that other TVC "expressions" like multipacks would likely have similar, all cardboard packages. Does that mean things like the convention exclusive 3-packs will go this route? I think we'll have an answer some time this summer.
As for the TVC basic figure line? I expect Hasbro to keep things as is. There has been over 40 years of history with this style of packaging. It set the standard for the action figure business. That legacy is not insignificant. We know it. Hasbro knows it. Disney & Lucasfilm know it. It built Star Wars as a brand,
Hasbro also has enough market research and sales date to tell them about collector / customer sentiments. Surely, the concerns that have been voiced over the past 48 hours have probably given the Hasbro Star Wars team a sense of just how much this could impact the state of the brand. And the phrase "the package is part of the product" is something that I've heard Hasbro people say themselves. With that in mind I expect that The Vintage Collection will be "grand-fathered" as an exception to this Hasbro policy. I also suspect that the Hasbro Star Wars team will push for a campaign to recycle the blisters or to use a recycled plastic material for the blisters.
And in the event that there is a future Hasbro Star Wars 3.75" action figure line in different packaging? I fully expect that line to adhere to the plastic-free packaging policy that Hasbro has laid out.
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These days its all pre-orders where I have no ability to control any of that and get what I get from Amazon/Target.com. I don't think I've purchased more than two figures at retail in the past two years.
I'll miss the 3.75" bubbles and the nostalgia of the form factor, but at the end of the day this doesn't really get me too upset. If I'm going to get upset about something with the figure line I'll spend my time bitching about the lack of truly new figures.
^ This ^
If I find something in person I pay pretty close attention to the paint details, eyes, etc. and have passed on figures I need because of bad paint issues. But now that almost everything is preorder, its a total crapshoot on what you get anyway, so the packaging is even less important. My biggest concern is getting hosed by re-packers and returns. We already see a fair amount of people stealing BAF parts or swapping figures with the bubbles - is that going to get 10x worse when you can't even see inside the package? I'm going to be suspicious of pretty much every package that didn't get mailed directly to me or didn't come straight out of a case.
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My biggest concern is getting hosed by re-packers and returns. We already see a fair amount of people stealing BAF parts or swapping figures with the bubbles - is that going to get 10x worse when you can't even see inside the package? I'm going to be suspicious of pretty much every package that didn't get mailed directly to me or didn't come straight out of a case.
+1 I think that's my biggest concern. There have been so many cases where the unseen figure pack-ins have been stolen from playsets and vehicles (Merrick) or even the item has been stolen and replaced with duplo blocks or unwanted other things. Lately, I've been buying my things online from reliable sources so they usually come straight from a box. It's Target and Walmart that might ship the returned item that you have to be wary about.
As much as I love the Vintage look with the figure next to the photo, if it changes then there's nothing I can do about it (save for making the choice of continuing or quitting). I'm not going to let that stress me out.
Speedermike posted a concept he came up with on facebook that I though was interesting. https://www.facebook.com/photo?fbid=10223936057803504&set=gm.1053849495203064 Check it out if you haven't seen it yet.
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I think I've found to solution. Hasbro is going to forgo the current packaging and everything will be in white mailer boxes. Unfortunately there are no poly bags.
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I get not using the plastic, but couldn't they still include a small window/opening to see a little bit of what's inside? The new Transformer line has this where there isn't a big enough to steal anything, but you can still see part of the actual figure inside to know what you're getting.
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I assume this is going to be a cost savings to Hasbro as well. Less packaging, less design effort since you can't do cool window boxes, etc. My guess is that we're not going to see any of the savings though...
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I too wonder what kind of impact that this will have on re-packers and returns and picking a figure for its paint job.I do keep the occasional carded double figure, and would certainly miss the nostalgia of the bubble. In the case of a carded figure the packaging is part of the product, and it would be a shame to lose that. I love the look of a nice wall of carded figures, especially TVC figures. I've always been someone who appreciates nice looking packaging, even if I plan on opening the item.
That all being said...
The environmental impacts here outweigh any other concerns I have. We need to start cutting back on excess plastic production, particularly single use plastics even of the recyclable variety. I'd be interested to see if Hasbro has any sort of hard data on what the total percentages of figures that are kept card vs opened. My guess is that between kids, openers, and carded collectors, the vast majority of figures are still opened. Once that happens, all plastic bubbles, windows, and baggies are all ultimately just trash. Alone, this may not make a significant change to the amount of plastic production in the world, but every bit helps. (The irony that I am still buying plastic toys is not lost on me, but I at least feel like those are not going to be trash any time soon, even if they will all eventually end up there.)
I'm also not at all naive enough to think Hasbro is doing this purely out of concern for the environment, like Dave already said this is all about the cost savings for them, not that we will see any of that as consumers. But if the net result is less plastic in local dumps, rivers, and oceans I'm good with that.
This is ultimately a small trade off for me and isn't like to significantly alter how I collect. I am mostly opening things anyways. 95% of what I buy anymore comes from an online retailer, so I can't check for paint jobs or repacks anyways, which really lessens the impact of this change for me. I'm willing to wait and see how it all plays out before I decide on what it means for my collecting habits.
I think I've found to solution. Hasbro is going to forgo the current packaging and everything will be in white mailer boxes. Unfortunately there are no poly bags.
We aren't too far off with the trooper builder 4-packs and their parchment wrapping paper... I actually would not be entirely opposed to that for single releases.
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This will be interesting for me because although I have always opened my 6” figures, I have never been able to bring myself to open those new style boxes with the art on the side. They just look so perfect as is. So I think I would actually be ok if they went away from those just so I could go back to opening my figures again, lol.
The one thing I didn’t think of til Jeff mentioned it was the inevitable 6” ROTJ Vintage style cardbacks we know are coming next year. It would suck for those to look all funky and different compared to the ANH and ESB ones. Maybe they can make an exception for those?
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It appears that Jayson updated this article BURSTING THE BUBBLE OF STAR WARS COLLECTIBLES AND COLLECTORS (https://yakfaceforums.com/main/2022/04/20/bursting-the-bubble-of-star-wars-collectibles-and-collectors/)
I was also able to finally take a look at this piece with mockups of Black Series figures (https://yakfaceforums.com/main/2021/03/19/hasbro-survey-regarding-plastic-free-packaging-for-black-series/) in the new packaging style. It is definitely not a surprise. I found the un-named Hasbro Star Wars 6" budget line of figures in the wild in the new packaging. Previous releases of this line had some plastic in the packaging. Others had a cut-out in the box where you could touch the figure. But these had an illustration of the character on the front as seen here (https://www.instagram.com/p/CcKu4TFuwjj/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link).
But as for the Yakface article? This paragraph caught my attention:
UPDATE: Hasbro currently has windowed (includes a cutout to see a portion of the figure) and windowless (solid, blind boxed) packaging for many of their lines including Fornite, Marvel Legends, Transformers, Power Rangers and more to come. Star Wars Vintage Collection, Retro Collection and Black Series will certainly be no different. But whatever the packaging style, there will be no plastic sheet or bubble in most cases.
It's a very significant development if this does happen. It would be a major shift in the aesthetic presentation of The Vintage Collection. And I have little doubt that the next Hasbro Star Wars livestream will address the issue, as will any follow-up Fan Site Q&A sessions. We appear to be due for one since we're a little less than 2 weeks away from what has become an annual Star Wars promotional event - May the Fourth Be With You.
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I found the un-named Hasbro Star Wars 6" budget line of figures in the wild in the new packaging.
It's been slowly changing over the past year. The budget 6" stuff, the Mission Fleet stuff, The Grogu Bounty stuff - all of it has lost the plastic over the past few months. I don't think most collectors paid attention since most don't collect these ancillary product lines.
Mission Fleet is a great example. You can see how the basic line specifically went from plastic bubble/insert tray on card to small window box with plastic insert tray to full no plastic/no window box -
(https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/81IHdKQ+JAL._AC_SL1500_.jpg) (https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/91JJ6Byz0WL._AC_SL1500_.jpg) (https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/81XJfc4tQZL._AC_SL1500_.jpg)
And I have little doubt that the next Hasbro Star Wars livestream will address the issue, as will any follow-up Fan Site Q&A sessions. We appear to be due for one since we're a little less than 2 weeks away from what has become an annual Star Wars promotional event - May the Fourth Be With You.
Yeah, I was thinking about that last night. If they announce something on May 4th, then they KNOW they will have to deal with fan reaction in-person at Celebration at the end of May. I can see some sort of grass roots "save the TVC bubbles!" type thing at Celebration even.
Part of me thinks they're going to go with "we can't comment at this time" for both May 4th and Celebration so they don't have to talk about it in-person with the fans... it would be best for them to rip the band-aid off, get the truth out there and then deal with it though.
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I think that *IF* they change Vintage Collection packaging, it's going be announced in a big way - an article on the Star Wars Official Site or one of those paid articles that turns up in USA Today or a comparable outlet. It would be VERY controlled. Because the stakes here are very high. And brand identity is a huge consideration here.
The Star Wars brand was based so much on the success of the toys. In the first year alone when Kenner introduced Star Wars toys sales were in the vicinity of $100 million. In 2022 dollars that's around $450 million, just from those 1977 - 1978 sales. And between 1978 and the time of the sale of Lucasfilm to Disney, toy sales for the Star Wars brand were around $3 billion. Over the span of licensed merchandise for Star Wars, the classic Kenner and then Hasbro black & silver packaging ran from 1978 > 1985, again in 2004, from 2006 > 2007, 2010 > 2013, and 2018 > 2022. That's 18 years over the history of the brand. The style of the Kenner cards has even been the inspiration for the cover art of numerous Star Wars releases from Marvel comics. So it's not overstating the case to say that the packaging look of the Kenner figures and The Vintage Collection is the look of Star Wars.
I suspect that Hasbro was not allowed to make a change in the look of the packaging unilaterally. This HAD to be approved by Lucasfilm licensing and probably Disney on account of the business and brand identity impact. The environmental considerations are significant in terms of public relations for Hasbro and Lucasfilm / Disney. But they also have to weigh the business impact, because this will have broader implications.
As for when this happens? That seems unclear, because we keep seeing new TVC figure releases coming out in blisters. The Target exclusive wave turned up in blisters. And I just saw an image of a carded Mandalorian Super Commando Captain circulating on social media - also in a blister.
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Changing the packaging to remove plastics, leaving TVC behind…
Pair that with going back to TAC level articulation and let’s get 3.75” scale figures down to something reasonable. $10.99 or $11.99 maybe?
The $15.99 thing is way too much.
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As someone who opens pretty much anything, I for the most part could care less. The only figures I keep on card anymore are doubles I get of OT characters that show up in the TVC line. I could see TVC being the “exception to the rule”, or maybe we will just see a switch to a look like the deluxe Fett. I’d like to see them finish out the original 96, but beyond that who cares. I’m fine with all cardboard. Like others, I get most of my stuff online anymore anyways, so paint is a gamble either way. Honestly I can’t say I’ve had a ton of trouble with paint overall since the face painting tech started being used.
To each their own, and I know everyone has different collecting habits/goals. It might be my age or years in the hobby, but I have more perspective on the world at this point and see how silly our complaints sound outside of a vacuum. “Did they stop making your toy line?” “No, but they are putting them in different boxes!” If cutting the plastic helps the world a bit, fantastic, give us the cardboard. Honestly I think most of the concern is over the TVC line from what I’ve seen. Maybe we have taken it for granted a bit. It used to be once or twice a year in the VOTC days, or it would go away sometimes and then come back like earlier TVC days. Like I said, finish the 96 in this same style, and then move on or make them special releases.
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I think that *IF* they change Vintage Collection packaging
I'm convinced it's happening, whether collectors like it or not. I'm guessing this ends one of two ways -
1) TVC 3.0 is born; Hasbro debuts new cardbacks with a cardboard box where the bubble used to be (maybe with an open window to see the figure, maybe not)
or
2) TVC 2.0 is dead; Hasbro debuts a brand new plastic-free package for 3.75" figures for 2023.
I think Hasbro's preference is #1. I think they are hoping that carded collectors will feel an inertia to keep buying even if what they will be buying doesn't strictly match the 'classic' TVC look. If those carded folks stop buying, I think Hasbro moves to option 2 with a much cheaper package design to save as much cost as possible to counteract the drop in sales/volume. Really small boxes with little wasted space (cheaper to make and more cost-effective to ship).
I will be happy to be proven wrong though. If Hasbro can find a way to keep the plastic TVC bubbles and still meet their corporate pledge deadline, it will mean something to the TVC carded collectors. That TVC classic look means a lot to many 3.75" collectors. I hope they get what they want... but I also hope they will be able to adjust if it plays out the other way.
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I'm convinced it's happening, whether collectors like it or not.
I’m with Jeff. This is a big commitment publicly. It’s done, stick a fork in it.
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Hasbro gives TVC a rest and brings out a different graphical look and packaging. They introduce TVC 3.0 in a few years when emotions have cooled and it wont face the backlash it will now.
Who knows? Maybe a lasting, high-temp, plant-based, plastic substitute will be developed by then and all of this hysteria will be made moot.
But wow, there is a lot of anger on other forums. Surprising since this look has only come out intermittently since Hasbro brought back figures 27 years ago.
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I get not using the plastic, but couldn't they still include a small window/opening to see a little bit of what's inside? The new Transformer line has this where there isn't a big enough to steal anything, but you can still see part of the actual figure inside to know what you're getting.
Can the heads be pulled off those legacy transformers? That's a problem lately
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Hasbro gives TVC a rest and brings out a different graphical look and packaging. They introduce TVC 3.0 in a few years when emotions have cooled and it wont face the backlash it will now.
I would be inclined to think that’s a possibility if they had not announced Vintage Collection items that are slated to be released in the middle of 2023. But that throne room set for The Book of Boba Fett is branded as TVC.
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I think they have a "reasonable" solution for TVC by packing the cardback with a box. Heck, they could go full mission fleet and put the whole thing in a box with a minty cardback on the inside. Then people have a figure and a cool vintage minty card despite not getting the sealed package. It's something at least. I'm really curious to see how they do the ROTJ 6inch figures though. The appeal there is the packaging and it's part of a larger set with the ANH and ESB figures. Not sure how well received those would be in a "special box" when it doesn't match any of the others and they're all figures that you can get in other boxes.
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Could this change pave the way for a few build-a-fig waves (without jacking up the price) to entice sales? I can certainly hope.
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Could this change pave the way for a few build-a-fig waves (without jacking up the price) to entice sales? I can certainly hope.
While I love the nostalgia of TVC, I'm really hoping the packaging change can allow for a lot more creativity in accessories, pack-ins, etc. One challenge with single carded TVC figures is it can't really accommodate anything other than basic accessories.
It'd be nice to see something fun like we've had in the past - build a droid, coins, freeze frame, etc. I'd be all for larger and simple accessories - crates, etc.
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Could this change pave the way for a few build-a-fig waves (without jacking up the price) to entice sales? I can certainly hope.
It'd be nice to see something fun like we've had in the past - build a droid, coins, freeze frame, etc. I'd be all for larger and simple accessories - crates, etc.
I'd take crates, mouse droids, chairs, tables, consoles, bottles, glasses, paintcans, trashcans, all around junk, build a droid parts, build a trooper parts, build an Episode IX Palpatine parts, spare army builder heads...but I'm antsy about any of it because they are so ready to throw that $27.99 world-building price around to amortize the tooling.
Remember when all the repacks came with a locker full of spare weapons?
Remember when the last carded Tatooine Luke came with a MOISTURE VAPORATOR accessory? I still buy that figure every time I see it.
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Remember when the last carded Tatooine Luke came with a MOISTURE VAPORATOR accessory? I still buy that figure every time I see it.
It is crazy to think that was 15 years ago. 15!
The days of those are long gone. Luke + Moisture Vaporator, Yoda + Kybuck, Han + Torture Rack - that kind of stuff is all $20-$25 "world building" sets now. The "build a weapon", "build a droid", coin, stand, etc stuff all died with the 5POA lines. Now that they know we will pay for it, it's hard to go back.
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GI Joe brand team Q&A round-up at HISS Tank (https://news.hisstank.com/2022/04/28/g-i-joe-product-team-roundtable-4-28-2022-77389) via Twitter (https://twitter.com/JediJaybird/status/1519797209654509577).
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FRdngGiXMAA536r.jpg)
Of note here is that "new o-ring packaging for upcoming figures" line. The two o-ring figure sets that they have done so far for GI Joe (Snake Eyes/Storm Shadow, Cobra Trooper 2-pack) have been in the same style packaging as the Kenner Retro IG-88/Dengar set (two carded figures in a box).
Also, really interested to see what happens with the 2023 Haslab Skystriker set. They showed bubble cards for those pack-in figures but I guess they can always lean on the 'final product may vary' disclaimer. Or can they get away with bubbles there because its direct to collectors via Haslab?
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I'm still concerned about people swiping things from the packages, so while more pack-ins would be cool that's also just one more thing that can go missing. Starting to feel like I might have to go 100% online ordering with this change and even then there's still risk.
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I'm still concerned about people swiping things from the packages
Stopped by the toy aisle at Target and saw the heads removed from the Marvel figure in a few of the open-package boxes. >:(
Hope the new SW design has a cutout to see part of the figure but not big enough for fingers to pull out the head.
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And so it begins...
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Stopped by the toy aisle at Target and saw the heads removed from the Marvel figure in a few of the open-package boxes.
And so it begins...
About a year ago, one of those viral TikTok challenges started to steal the head off a Lebron James Space Jam figure (https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/stealing-lebrons-head). It was a HUGE issue for that toy line. The packaging had to be completely revamped, the manufacturer (Moose Toys) had to send out "repair kits" (basically an adhesive plastic strip to hold the head in place) to retail to try to stop it from happening. There was a HUGE amount of product that had to be trashed or sent back.
I would hope Hasbro/Mattel would learn from that but...
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About a year ago, one of those viral TikTok challenges started to steal the head off a Lebron James Space Jam figure (https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/stealing-lebrons-head). It was a HUGE issue for that toy line. The packaging had to be completely revamped, the manufacturer (Moose Toys) had to send out "repair kits" (basically an adhesive plastic strip to hold the head in place) to retail to try to stop it from happening. There was a HUGE amount of product that had to be trashed or sent back.
I would hope Hasbro/Mattel would learn from that but...
Yep - that's what I was referring to. I saw dozens of pictures of the leftover headless figures on the MN Toy Posse page along with seeing several in-store myself. What a waste. In totally unrelated news, anyone in the market for a bunch of Lebron James heads? Asking for a friend.
I keed, I keed. ;D
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I wonder if they could do some sort of tamper-proof package with some sort of perforated cardboard with a pull tab? Once opened the perforation would have little color indicator to show the package had been opened.
(Think a cardboard version of Oreo packaging.)
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Or figures in milk cartons. Can't reseal that with tape.
I am only half-joking.
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I wonder if they could do some sort of tamper-proof package with some sort of perforated cardboard with a pull tab? Once opened the perforation would have little color indicator to show the package had been opened.
(Think a cardboard version of Oreo packaging.)
That or something like a red line in the tape that shows as broken when the tape is cut? There's got to be an easy tamper solution out there. Just not sure how cost effective it is or if they would care.
I remember when Walmart first came out with the self-checkout machines. A news anchor was interviewing some WM bigshot and asked if they were worried about increased shoplifting. His reply was that they forecasted an increase in theft, but that the savings from fewer checkout people would still be a huge net gain. Profit always trumps integrity I guess. Hasbro gets paid by retailers, not consumers, so they might not really care.
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I was on a work call and only partially listening to the livestream, but it didn't appear they addressed the future packaging (no plastic) changes. Did I miss the discussion of this or did they totally skip it?
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Totally skipped it…but they had a fun R2-D2 on hand! ;D
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I'm thinking while this will happen for the Black Series...it's not happening in TVC. The bubble on the card is just too integral to the product for them to change it.
That being said, I wish they had addressed it in the livestream....not talking about it at all was not a good move.
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I'm thinking while this will happen for the Black Series...it's not happening in TVC. The bubble on the card is just too integral to the product for them to change it.
That being said, I wish they had addressed it in the livestream....not talking about it at all was not a good move.
I think they might not want to talk about it publicly because TVC might be getting grand-fathered in to keeping the bubble. Hasbro has shown mockups of figures on cards with bubbles that are slated to be released in early 2023.
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Agreed Nick. I think the internet is going nuts over this plastic free packaging but the TVC isn't going to go that route. It would've been nice for the team to at least mention that during the livestream to end the freak out.
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And if the announcement affirmed that TVC is going plastic-free, enough of the collecting community would have been stirred into a negative frenzy much like what happened a couple of weeks ago and taken the shine off of what should be strictly Star Wars.
Time and place for everything.
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Like many of you, I am convinced that TVC is not going to change, and I think they didn't address it because they were specifically told NOT to address it. Think of the up-roar from Marvel Legends fans if they find out that Hasbro Star Wars isn't going to be impacted by the "no plastic packaging" mandate.
There is still a chance regular Black Series releases will be impacted, but I think that's still up-in-the-air. Depends on what kind of reaction they got from that survey they sent around with packaging mock-ups (that all looked horrible).
I do think things like Vintage-like-carded Black Series figures will still be a "thing". No way after starting back in 2017 for the 40th Anniversary of ANH, they aren't going to at least do a couple waves of Return of the Jedi Black Series figures on Vintage-like cardbacks.
There's also a really good chance we will probably also see more Credit Collection releases for The Mandalorian.
Both Vintage-like packaging sublines give them the opportunity to double-dip on figure molds, which has been a major part of the Hasbro Star Wars brand strategy for many years now, so no way are they going to just give that up - and no-one is buying a re-pack of a Mandalorian or ROTJ 6" figure on a Vintage-like Cardback that doesn't feature a clear plastic bubble.
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I think there will NOT be any plastic. And there's a lot of wishful thinking going on all over the internet. I hope I'm wrong, but expect to survive if I'm right.
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The more I see items like the Retro 6 pack they just revealed, the more I see them coming up with ridiculous work-arounds to their own program.
And all the TVC figures from this week's preorders are scheduled to ship in Spring 2023, which is after their deadline for plastic free packaging, and they won't address it until they do, so who knows?
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One gripe with the latest plastic free packaging on the deluxe figures (Boba Fett and Ahsoka) is that you really have to inspect the folded paper packets holding the accessories to make sure you got them all. There aren't any instructions or other helpful inserts that list what is in the package, and I get a little concerned that there is something super small stuck in one of the corners that I'm missing.
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One gripe with the latest plastic free packaging on the deluxe figures (Boba Fett and Ahsoka) is that you really have to inspect the folded paper packets holding the accessories to make sure you got them all. There aren't any instructions or other helpful inserts that list what is in the package, and I get a little concerned that there is something super small stuck in one of the corners that I'm missing.
I hate that companies don't include basic instruction sheets for anything these days. What do those cost, like a penny to include in the box? Or heck, print it on the box if you have to. They should bring back the little mini catalogs of product as well - those were awesome to leaf through even if you already had the stuff.
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There aren't any instructions or other helpful inserts that list what is in the package
I hate that companies don't include basic instruction sheets for anything these days. What do those cost, like a penny to include in the box? Or heck, print it on the box if you have to. They should bring back the little mini catalogs of product as well - those were awesome to leaf through even if you already had the stuff.
The problem is there is no longer a "USA-only package" anymore. All packaging is designed to be sold anywhere in the world. If they wanted to include some kind of insert/catalog, it would have to be in like 15 different languages, like those little paper inserts in the TVC figures with tiny text.
In one of the live-streams, can't recall if it was GI Joe or Marvel, the Hasbro reps said that all the "plastic free" package should have a picture (no words because of language issues) that shows what should be in the box. Something like these white boxes on the backs of the package:
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FT0hCNFWAAEG8G7.jpg)
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So they're Ikea now.
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I'm good with this so I know what to be looking for in the little paper wrappings. Still having an Ikea-like insert to show how things are supposed to connect together would sometimes be helpful.
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I'm good with this so I know what to be looking for in the little paper wrappings. Still having an Ikea-like insert to show how things are supposed to connect together would sometimes be helpful.
Even Ikea has piece of paper showing crude drawings of what's in the box and how it fits together. Good point on the language barriers, but pictures are fine. Heck, the catalog doesn't even need to have English text in it - they can show 10 figures with numbers next to them and a key that maps to the 10 figure names.
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Real pics are nice. Diagrams can be hard to decipher.
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An update from Hasbro - 6" figures going plastic free; 3.75" stuff likely keeps it's bubble -
On 6"
"most 6-inch figures will transition to plastic-free packaging by early 2023."
"As part of the shift away from window boxes, you’ll see highly detailed artwork and exciting new imagery on each package featuring iconic characters and their figures inside. This includes new packaging art that will showcase the articulation and poseability of each figure."
Here is Hasbro's example/mock-up of the 'virtually plastic free' packaging for a Black Series 6" figure:
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FYNrO0-XkAAnkqU.jpg)
On 3.75"
"Our goal does not include packaging for fan collectible products like 3.75” action figures, where packaging is part of the product experience and typically retained intact for fan display and collections. Those lines include Star Wars Vintage and Retro, as well as other collectible brands such as Marvel Retro and the G.I. JOE Retro. In support of Hasbro’s lower carbon strategy and upcoming science-based targets, our fan collectible blister packaging will continue to be made with either plant-based or recycled PET content."
So props to Hasbro for making the "right" decision for fans of TVC carded collections. I really thought there was enough smoke behind the rumors of TVC bubble disappearing that there had to be some fire there. (Part of me wonders if the rumors were floated out there by Hasbro to test the waters?) Happy to be wrong about that for all those who love the TVC cardback look and style. Enjoy it while it lasts!
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Well at least that should be the end of the near constant complaining from everyone about TVC...
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Hmm, was kind of hoping they would go with a whole new box style for the 6” figures, I’ve always had a hard time bringing myself to open these newer ones. Maybe this will help break that spell though.
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Well at least that should be the end of the near constant complaining from everyone about TVC...
Dude...how long have you been in this hobby???
BTW...I told all of you months ago they weren't changing TVC. I want credit!
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I've been feeling the same way. It would have been akin to a classic American brand changing its logo - like when Coca Cola went from the old script logo and introduced new Coke along with the new label.
As for the complaining? I hardly expect that to end anytime soon. Because there's always something new to complain about.
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Another pic of the upcoming "Plastic Free Packaging" (PFP) for Black Series from SDCC - Deluxe 6" NED-B:
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FYODXHBX0AEOWNk.jpg)
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Well at least that should be the end of the near constant complaining from everyone about TVC...
Dude...how long have you been in this hobby???
BTW...I told all of you months ago they weren't changing TVC. I want credit!
Oh yeah totally, I just meant about he bubbles. Every Yakface IG thread about this was 900 people reminding everyone that they’re “QUITTING IF THEY MAKE SUCH A DRASTIC DECISION AND RUIN THE CLASSIC FEEL OFNTHE PACKAGING AND MURDER A BUNCH OF PUPPIES LIKE THIS!!!”
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Another pic of the upcoming "Plastic Free Packaging" (PFP) for Black Series from SDCC - Deluxe 6" NED-B:
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FYODXHBX0AEOWNk.jpg)
I actually like this presentation for The Black Series. We've been through a number of iterations of The Black Series packaging styles, and I think that line can roll with the change and not lose its stride. And the continuity of the mural style isn't impacted at all.
I think the concerns about the lack of a window in the package are still valid. The number of images that I saw of damaged TVC Deluxe Boba Fett figures, as well as swapped contents, are an indicator that collectors are probably going to want to open their TBS figures sooner rather than later. The number of incidents will bear out if the defects and swaps are a common issue or not.
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So, has it occurred to anyone at Hasbro that they could help save the environment through other means like lifting minimum order quantities, providing group shipping instead of a box per figure, setting up a subscription figure service, etc? I have to think that reducing transportation waste, extra packaging, consumer gas costs, etc. would do a lot more than eliminating a plastic window.
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So, has it occurred to anyone at Hasbro that they could help save the environment through other means like lifting minimum order quantities, providing group shipping instead of a box per figure, setting up a subscription figure service, etc? I have to think that reducing transportation waste, extra packaging, consumer gas costs, etc. would do a lot more than eliminating a plastic window.
Yeah, it really doesn't seem to make a lot of sense at times. They're a toy company making things out of plastic/oil/chemicals, and they're going to worry about a little plastic packaging when their whole product is plastic?
I like the effort to minimize plastic (not eliminate) and use recyclable plastic, but at the end of the day they're in the business of marketing their products and its surprising to me that they think they'll get more bang by eliminating plastic while making their product look lame in the store. Are collectors, kids, parents, and grandparents really making buying decisions based on the amount of plastic that a package has in it? I think not.
If they want to be great environmental stewards they should buy carbon offsets, plant trees, use recycled materials, buy solar panels, etc. There are lots of ways to drive a sustainability initiative.
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An update from Hasbro - 6" figures going plastic free; 3.75" stuff likely keeps it's bubble -
On 3.75"
"Our goal does not include packaging for fan collectible products like 3.75” action figures, where packaging is part of the product experience and typically retained intact for fan display and collections. Those lines include Star Wars Vintage and Retro, as well as other collectible brands such as Marvel Retro and the G.I. JOE Retro. In support of Hasbro’s lower carbon strategy and upcoming science-based targets, our fan collectible blister packaging will continue to be made with either plant-based or recycled PET content."
Exactly as I predicted two months ago - TVC will remain un-touched and there's no point in "Retro" if you're not making a product that looks like it was a Kenner figure from the 70s so those won't be affected either. While they didn't specifically say it - the Vintage-packaged style of Black Series figures like the 40th Anniversary lines, the Credit Collection and the 50th Anniversary Lucasfilm stuff (which is meant to mimic the older carded figure styles) all most likely fit into the "packaging for fan collectible products" umbrella.
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A look at what might have been in store for TVC if Hasbro didn't pivot at the last minute and decide to keep the bubbles...
New 6" plastic-free carded D&D figure from Hasbro:
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FdV7QNeXEAAbvda.jpg)
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I still say that plastic free was never in the cards for TVC. Changing the packaging would have ended the line.
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I found this interesting - in Hasbro's latest Environment, Social and Governance policy update (https://assets-us-01.kc-usercontent.com/500e0a65-283d-00ef-33b2-7f1f20488fe2/bea4cf3d-f389-46be-9311-62f83640b134/ESG%20Progress%20Report%2021-22.pdf), TVC got a special call-out to highlight why they are keeping the bubbles... page 19:
"Sometimes packaging is part of the product and not intended to be single use. Based on feedback from our fans regarding collectible products, we learned the plastic blister packaging is a key part of the product experience. With collectibles like our 3.75” STAR WARS Vintage and Retro action figures, fans typically retain packaging intact for display. To give our fans the best possible experience, we will continue to offer traditional packaging, made with plant-based or recycled PET content."
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fm2EfwiXwAAXFn3.jpg)
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Even though it is 6" related, I'm putting this here to keep the "plastic free" talk all in one place... from Yakface/BanthaSkull (https://twitter.com/yak_face/status/1644116418290413573)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FtESw2CWYAIJ6oN.jpg)
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Sales must have cratered for them to backtrack so fast.
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Sales must have cratered for them to backtrack so fast.
For sure. Also, it sounds like there were substantial issues with figures breaking in-package during shipping and you couldn't tell you were buying a broken figure (like the D&D animated figures) (https://twitter.com/JediDefender/status/1613971462703939586) along with lots of anecdotal stories of figure swaps hitting Amazon/Target/Walmart thanks to returns with the closed boxes.
Happy for the 6" collectors out there that Hasbro is reversing course on this.
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It wouldn't take a rocket scientist to figure out windowless packages were going to introduce quality issues, and be ripe for scammers.
My guess is the big retailers got on Hasbro's case quick about all the crap they had to deal with for returned broken and scammed/swapped product.
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On a related note its interesting to see that Hasbro Pulse ships their goodies padded with an eco-friendly geometric paper insert. Kinda like bubble wrap. Pretty cool, and a lot more ecological than the air bubble padding.