JediDefender.com Forums
Collectibles => Past Hasbro 3.75" Lines => The Black Series 3.75" => Topic started by: Jeff on February 1, 2013, 12:18 PM
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OK, all we know so far is that we're probably getting the Vader artwork on a boring cardback for the Black Series 3.75" figures.
What are your hopes and dreams for this line? What is the one thing that would kill it for you? What is the one thing that would make it the greatest line ever?
For me, jumping to a MSRP of >$10 would kill my enthusiasm. $10 is really the ultimate cap for these and I'd be willing to give up some articulation (down to the 9-11 points range - I'm fine with no ankles and cut elbows sometimes) if it meant shaving a buck or two off the price.
Make it the Greatest line ever? Why the debut of the Tonnika Sisters of course! Those would be the ultimate "15th Cantina Guy". ;)
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Make it the Greatest line ever? Why the debut of the Tonnika Sisters of course! Those would be the ultimate "15th Cantina Guy". ;)
Well, they said who wants the "15th Cantina Guy" but they said nothing about the 3 or so Cantina Gals that have yet to be made. ;D
A higher price point would kill it for me. I'm already just getting OT figures at higher prices if I can't find them in store and falling back on secondary stores like 5 Below (with some help from friends) to get PT ones or if I don't find it I can live without it. I don't mind lower PoA. Not all figures need to be super articulated anyways...maybe the main heroes and villains and troopers, secondary to background figures can be less-so.
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I think $10 would be a top limit price wise for me as well.
I would like to keep seeing never before made figures, like the Sisters.
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I just hope they have solid articulation and cool figure choices. And that there's enough distribution for people to find what they want. The inability to find what I want at retail is really the only thing that has me wanting to jump ship on collecting. I don't mind paying for quality stuff, but I do mind having to buy two full cases over the internet just to get my four new figures.
Personally, I could kind of care less about the launch price point. People were up in arms about $10-11 prices not so long ago, but how many BOGO and BOGO50 sales have we seen in just the last year? They won't sell much at that price, so we'll start seeing sales and internet discounts...maybe even more TJ Maxx and 5 Below deals over the long haul. I don't want to overpay, but even if they come out at >$10, we'll be able to find them for less than that if we're a little patient.
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I just hope they have solid articulation and cool figure choices. And that there's enough distribution for people to find what they want. The inability to find what I want at retail is really the only thing that has me wanting to jump ship on collecting. I don't mind paying for quality stuff, but I do mind having to buy two full cases over the internet just to get my four new figures.
Personally, I could kind of care less about the launch price point. People were up in arms about $10-11 prices not so long ago, but how many BOGO and BOGO50 sales have we seen in just the last year? They won't sell much at that price, so we'll start seeing sales and internet discounts...maybe even more TJ Maxx and 5 Below deals over the long haul. I don't want to overpay, but even if they come out at >$10, we'll be able to find them for less than that if we're a little patient.
+1
First and foremost, I have to be able to find stuff in stores. It all starts there for me.
I also worry that Hasbro will be spread too thin with a new 6" line, 3&3/4 black series, Movie Heroes, and whatever the hell they decide to do with Clone Wars...
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In addition to solid articulation (I want the standard to be at least what the 2006 AT-AT Driver and Death Star Gunner figures have), I hope paint apps and plastic quality don't decline. The Class I vehicles I've seen so far are AWFUL in that regard, worse quality than the Indiana Jones line had. Hopefully that changes.
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My greatest hope would be an all-inclusive line that very quickly covers the basic characters (Luke, Han, Anakin in iconic outfits) and brings in those last few remaining hold outs that have yet to be made. (15thCA, Cliegg Lars, etc) Something to get the toys set up to lead into the all new movie stuff.
I guess what I would like to see is a return to the OTC model, get a definitive line out there that can stand by itself as a collection of Star Wars figures with no need to borrow main hero figures from previous lines to make the collection feel complete. I don't mind having to borrow a Yarna from Legacy or Ben Quadrinaros from last year to bulk up the "one of everybody" loose collection. It would be nice and long overdue to have another line that could stand by itself, especially since this line is being put out as "for the collector."
I wouldn't balk at reissues of previous sculpts as long as they met the above criteria. I would want waves made up of twelve "new to the line" figures each. I would be happy with 4-5 waves a year, and maybe 10-20 of those figures being brand new, non-reissues.
I fear we will get the same old case ratios and the line will be difficult/impossible to collect like it has been these last five years.
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I'd like to see them bring back
the hologram pack-in figurines but in new hot neon colours.
Spring action accessories.
Force Files
Enviroment battle stands that sort of connect to form nothing especially useful
Collector coins that you have to buy crappy figures to get all of.
Secret weapons!
I ruined my joke, I actually liked secret weapons.
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Collector coins that you have to buy crappy figures to get all of.
I love the original POTF coin set (one day the 63rd coin will be mine, damn last coin still eludes me), so coins would be the only thing to get my all in.
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With regards to the Black Series 3.75" line, I think that if the selection lacks any type of wow factor, and if Hasbro pumps out the same old uninspired crap (ie another Clone Trooper, another Anakin, another Obi-Wan, etc), they should just pull the plug on the entire 3.75" line.
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What constitutes the "wow factor" 3000 figures into the line? What can they give us that we haven't seen before?
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What constitutes the "wow factor" 3000 figures into the line? What can they give us that we haven't seen before?
How about an 8D8/EV-9D9 two pack with pull-apart tortured droid and torture mechanism? Or how about some Build-A-Droid sets of 2 or 3 with interchangable parts? Or a 3.75" scaled Krayt Dragon or Dagobah Dragon Snake? Figures like the Tonnika Sisters, Velken Tezeri, Toryn Farr, or heck at this point, even a figure of Jamie Farr would be very much welcomed...anything but the same old regurgitated crap like another Anakin, another Clone Trooper, another Obi-Wan. Those are the type of items that would fulfill my personal "wow factor" requirements at this point in time.
I'd also like to see a return of "ultra" or "deluxe" figures packaged with diorama pieces. Larger accessories such as the Tractor Beam panel thingy from ANH, or the War Room console from ROTJ before the Battle of Endor, or a Funeral Pyre for Vader. Hasbro just needs to excercise some inspired creativity with the 3.75" line. It might be asking for too much, but how about some frickin' playsets for the "3000 figures into the line?"
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Figures like the Tonnika Sisters, Velken Tezeri, Toryn Farr, or heck at this point, even a figure of Jamie Farr would be very much welcomed...
They made two 3 3/4" figures of Jamie Farr in the 80's M.A.S.H. line. Why would kids want to play M.A.S.H.? I did have one, though.
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I had MASH guys for hostages Cobra would take. :-\
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My hope is that with Hasbro apparently going with the "budget" approach as it relates to Movie Heroes (5 POA), they'll finally admit that the Vintage/Black Series/whatever line is a collector-focused line and offer a figure assortment that respects that fact. I'm talking super-articulation as the bare minimum with no corners being cut on deco and no sacrifice of film authenticity for stupid pack-ins and gimmicks.
We already know we aren't getting BAD pieces so I'm hoping they realize anything other than a stand (and we all have all we need of those at this point) as a pack-in is a waste. Use whatever budget for those on including lightsaber hilts that attach to belts, or for a frigging leg strap for the holster. Lack of holster aside, the Vintage RFT is a perfect example of great accessories packed in to add value, so more of that where they can do it would be great.
And if they're going for a true collector-focused line, and with the main characters being well-represented in the budget line for kids, don't sacrifice spaces in the Black Series to repack Obi-Wan and Anakin and X-Wing Luke for the millionth time. If you do a main character in the Black Series, make it a version that isn't identical, costume-wise to another figure (like 3 identical Obi-Wans in 3 different assortments). Do a ROTJ-deco Boba Fett using the Evolutions body with mods as necessary, or do a cloth-lower coat Hoth Han with the hood up.
My other main hope is that they not overdo things in terms of the number of figures released. Part of the problem these last few years is there have been too many figures split across too many "waves" and 90% of them didn't show up to retail or, if they did show up, were victims of horrible case packs and only showed up once. They could cut the line to 24 totally new figures for the entire year (4 waves of 6 figures) and release an assortment every 3 months, with the first release being a case of 12 figures (2 of each new figure) and, in the off months, release a revision case with the more popular figures as a fill-in assortment. No short packs, no chase figures (which is my biggest fear with the 6" line), and for God's sake, no Phantom Menace figures for a long time.
Like I said, each wave would have 6 brand new figures which would encompass five of the six films and, as available, realistic versions of CW characters. I won't go into personal wish lists but I think we could (mostly) all agree that realistic versions of animated Jedi who appeared in the films (Mace, Fisto, Koon) with forearm armor isn't going to be interesting. Do stuff like Bo-Katan, Pong Krell, Hondo Ohnaka, Duchess Satine, Savage Opress, or even Rex and Wolffe instead of just blowing a spot on "Saesee Tiin in Leg Armor".
My biggest hope is that, whatever they do, people are able to actually find it. If Hasbro doesn't get their **** together this fall, especially after the complete cluster**** of the last 3 years, a lot of the people who have been sitting on the fence and giving the big H another chance are going to jump ship completely.
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All I want is an interesting selection of never before done characters, and if they have to do a Luke, or Obi-Wan, just use the exact same one that has been released before, so there is no need to "collect" it, and it doesn't waste tooling money.
I don't need pack ins, or droid pieces, or anything except for a weapon or two.
Yes, include realistic Clone Wars, and EU.
Understand that the buyers for this line are the long-time fans who have many, many figures, and to keep them interested, offer an oddball, unpredictable figure selection.
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...anything but the same old regurgitated crap like another Anakin, another Clone Trooper, another Obi-Wan.
And if they're going for a true collector-focused line, and with the main characters being well-represented in the budget line for kids, don't sacrifice spaces in the Black Series to repack Obi-Wan and Anakin and X-Wing Luke for the millionth time.
All I want is an interesting selection of never before done characters, and if they have to do a Luke, or Obi-Wan, just use the exact same one that has been released before, so there is no need to "collect" it, and it doesn't waste tooling money.
Without the kenner cardbacks to suck in the carded collecting guys, figure selection could be the thing that ultimately makes or breaks the Black Series 3.75" line for many, many people.
Take a look at the figures they had planned for the first two waves of Droid Factory - not much there that meets the desired "wow factor" you guys are talking about. Pretty much everything there is the stuff that Force Guy described as "the same old regurgitated crap": Another Arena Padme, R2-D2, AotC Anakin, Vader, Sandtrooper, and at least THREE clones in the first 20 planned figures.
The only real "wow factor" NEW minor characters were the BADs themselves, figures like FA-4 and R5-X2, which we may not even be getting right away. :(
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Without the kenner cardbacks to suck in the carded collecting guys, figure selection could be the thing that ultimately makes or breaks the Black Series 3.75" line for many, many people.
Take a look at the figures they had planned for the first two waves of Droid Factory - not much there that meets the desired "wow factor" you guys are talking about. Pretty much everything there is the stuff that Force Guy described as "the same old regurgitated crap": Another Arena Padme, R2-D2, AotC Anakin, Vader, Sandtrooper, and at least THREE clones in the first 20 planned figures.
The only real "wow factor" NEW minor characters were the BADs themselves, figures like FA-4 and R5-X2, which we may not even be getting right away. :(
Yeah... Hasbro definitely has to choose the lineup carefully. If they kick off the line with the AOTC-heavy wave it will be DOA. If they shuffle figures around and can't add any new sculpts, a mix like this might work for the first two waves:
Wave 1:
Bespin Vader
212th Clone Trooper
R2-D2
Sand Trooper (this guy actually sold VERY well in my area last year, and I was actually excited for the pauldron variant)
R5-X2
TC-70
Clone Pilot
Padme
Anakin
Geonosian Warrior
Pablo Jill
Biggs Darklighter
Wave 2:
Mara Jade
Captain Rex
Ceremony Luke Skywalker
Scout Trooper
Mace Windu
A-Wing Pilot
TIE Fighter Pilot
Clone Trooper Sgt.
R8-B7
FA-4
Battle Droid
Luminara Unduli
As bad as the "same old same old" stuff is to hardcore collectors, characters like Vader, R2-D2, Luke, and most clones still appear to be solid sellers. I don't see those guys being a problem out if they get released. I can see Rex and Mara Jade being extremely popular, and maybe Luminara, Mace, Pablo Jill, and the Scout Trooper as decent sellers... not too sure though about the Jedi as those released in TVC were hit & miss. The biggest problems with the Legacy/Build A Droid lineup are the AOTC characters, Pilots, and too an extent the Build-A-Droids themselves. I don't think there is any overall desire for AOTC characters and Pilots seem to have hit their saturation point. As for the droids, they might suffer from being too obscure and/or too expensive. Even with a mix like the one I suggested above it will be a hard sell, so hopefully Hasbro has some new figures planned to mix things up...
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I tend not to go into any of it with expectations... I think, even with solid wave mixes and figure diversity, it's a deep hole to climb out of that the Hasbro SW line is in right now.
I think if people could see the #'s on something like this, I think figures are ALL prone to pegwarming faster now than they ever were. I'm seeing now where the Gammorean Guard isn't exactly the hot commodity he was. It wasn't like he hit 5 Below heavily though, nor is that store even everywhere, but yet his figure that's in the case hitting TRU's now isn't always the first to go anymore. He went from rare to "eh" kind of fast to me. It's a microscope on the line for sure, but it says to me I think Hasbro's going to struggle out of the gate regardless. I think it's just a deep hole they're in.
So I hold no grand expectations. I'm going to buy what I like... I'm certainly not going to buy a figure just for his cardback now (I did that with some vinty's though usually only on a good sale, like R5-D4).
For me, it'll be pick and choose, and I'm one of the guys still here that's a hardcore collector looking forward to whatever they decide to unveil this weekend. Yeah that's actual optomism! I seem to be the minority.
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"the same old regurgitated crap": Another Arena Padme
I for one have been waiting for a good Area Padme since I first saw the leaked picture of the abomination that was the 2002 one.
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Jesse, I'm at a point where I will pick and choose and well. And for many, many years, I bought EVERYTHING!
I think the big issue really is character choice. I feel that I already have great sculpts of most characters. That being said, I can think of dozens from the films that I would still like to see in plastic. Many more if they folded Clone Wars realistic figures into the line. Rako Hardeen? Oh yeah!
I think I had said this before, but if Hasbro called it quits on the 3.75 today, I'd be happy. Looked at all together, the collection has to be the most intricate and detailed versions of a fictional world ever produced in toy form. Nothing else comes close.
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My hopes? That Hasbro can find a balance in the 3.75" figure system to keep it both viable AND profitable. So what does that mean?
Distribution that works.
Working closer with the retailers to get figures, etc to stores in a timely and even fashion on a regular schedule.
Balanced Character Selection / Case Packs
We've seen what happens when some fan oriented figures come to market in too high of a quantity. The fact is that I can STILL find a Yarna as well as a Willrow Hood on the pegs of a TRU store if I really wanted to. Those figures are now going on 4 - 5 years old. And this is clearly a case where short-packing is appropriate. That 15th cantina alien probably needs to be put in this category, and probably needs to be short packed.
There's also a major fact that collectors need to get over: core characters NEED to stay in the line with a higher degree of regularity than might suit our own sensibilities. Sure, collectors may have some 30+ renditions of Darth Vader, Luke Skywalker, Yoda or Obi-Wan Kenobi. But these are the characters that sell to parents & kids. If we want the line to remain viable & profitable, these characters need to be readily available to the much larger market segment that is parents & their kids.
Aside from that, what am I hoping to see?
Continuing on with realistic versions of Clone Wars characters. The rumblings are that the Clone Wars animated line is coming to a close. So why not continue the trend of making realist versions of Clone Wars characters? We already have three of those in Anakin, Obi-Wan and Ahsoka, plus another two scheduled in Mace Windu and Rex. There are definitely some prime candidates for figures from seasons 4 and 5 that might sell reasonably well. Darth Maul? Death Watch? Savage Opress? Darth Sidious?
From the OT, there's still plenty of fertile ground. I can think of a number of renditions of core characters that would be most welcome. Throw in some of Jabba's goons, Imperials and Rebels and you've got some good 2nd & 3rd tier characters. And with the PT? TPM and it's characters need some time off after the TPM 3-D fiasco. AOTC and ROTS still have some options in terms of character selection, but Hasbro needs to be incredibly selective.
Also, how about working in some more video game characters? Figures from KOTOR and SWTOR have been pretty well received. Again, they need to be done very selectively, but if Hasbro is going to keep up with the broadening Star Wars fan market which is very much about video games, they need to approach this market segment seriously.
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Wave 1:
Bespin Vader
212th Clone Trooper
R2-D2
Sand Trooper (this guy actually sold VERY well in my area last year, and I was actually excited for the pauldron variant)
R5-X2
TC-70
Clone Pilot
Padme
Anakin
Geonosian Warrior
Pablo Jill
Biggs Darklighter
http://forum.starwars-figuren.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=406&whichpage=2 (http://forum.starwars-figuren.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=406&whichpage=2)
Darth Vader #6, so you got one right!
Padme, Anakin, Scout Trooper and Clone Sgt.?
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Take a look at the figures they had planned for the first two waves of Droid Factory - not much there that meets the desired "wow factor" you guys are talking about. Pretty much everything there is the stuff that Force Guy described as "the same old regurgitated crap": Another Arena Padme, R2-D2, AotC Anakin, Vader, Sandtrooper, and at least THREE clones in the first 20 planned figures.
The only real "wow factor" NEW minor characters were the BADs themselves, figures like FA-4 and R5-X2, which we may not even be getting right away. :(
And thats why i decided to quit before the revealing of the 6 inch line. I was bored by what they had revealed and felt it was a good time to get out. I still do think it is and am done with the4 inch line, most importantly i am ok with it. I am going to pick up some of the OT 6 inch figures but just if i like it.
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There'll be nothing new for months. Quitting isn't an option...it's a temporary reality for everyone!
Predictions this year:
Wave 1 and 2 are findable, but Hasbro underproduces...some fans are lefting wanting. Mara Jade skyrockets on ebay.
Wave 3 hits just before Xmas and is never seen again.
Wave 4 is held off for an agonizing street date in spring 2014.
Legends abounds, but like previous legends, no new product (characters) for months. Pegs of R4's accumulate with Mace Windus beside them.
The online Vader Evolutions set becomes this years Pod Racers pack.
2012's Naboo fighters become part of some value pack exclusive, paired with an undesirable vehicle, at a big box retailer that requires paid membership.
2014: Hasbro cancels all vehicles that aren't exclusives.