GH Q&A -- Mike Sullenger & Randy Shoemaker of Hasbro Marketing

[dafoo]

I don't get how The SA clone could be more to produce.

PERHAPS more to assemble, but that's it.

ok so we have a limitation on how many you can make, just keep cranking them out as much as you can with the mold you've got

[Morgbug]

Ok, let's be realistic here.  While I accept that Unleashed is more expensive to produce, it is not substantially higher than a McFarlane Movie Maniacs figure.  Neither is more detailed than the other.  Neither has better or more or less paint detailing.  The only marginal advantage that McFarlane has is a pretty standardized clamshell and less intensive artwork.  But even at that, the bubble and backing card minus the artwork are the same for every unleashed figure now.  Scott hit it right, reshipping stuff no-one wanted was dumb.  But to suggest it's too expensive a line?  You (Hasbro) charge a 50% premium for basically the same figure as McFarlane produces but it's too expensive?  Hmm, maybe you oughta talk to someone down in Arizona. 

There are a ton of Clones in Episode III and similar to the upcoming Target one, there are a lot of Expanded Universe type of Clones. In order to take advantage of that and make sure that we have enough Clones out in the market. We only have one sculpt of that super articulated Clone Trooper so we're limited as to how many we can make and we don't want to stop making the white one as well because we know people want that. So, we use our whole library of Episode III Clones for the repaints and variations.

I calls 'em as I sees 'em and this is crap.  It's a better sculpt (marginally) without an action feature.  Wouldn't the action feature costing equate to the SA costing?  Really, #6 and #41 aren't that different for articulation overall.  This is just an inability to admit that they keep putting action features out there and adults don't want them.  Self-delusional, if you will, that kids are buying these up.  One word: pmundheim. 

A clone is a clone, except for the subtle differences where you're making a different sculpt, like Baccarra.  No one's asking for all the different helmet-pauldron-skirt combinations in all colors (though we'd buy those too).  They're asking for the basic #41 sculpt/articulation to be the standard figure with only paint variations.  Cheap, easy, done.   

It sounds like the modified TIE Fighter is on the way,

While I'd like to believe it will finally be to scale, I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest the word modified actually applies to the packaging, not the scale or the ship itself. 

Jedi Master points: "we tried something with that with the auctions. Not as many people were able to take advantage of it as we had hoped. So I don't see us doing Jedi Master points again in the future."

With ready recognition that the US is the major market, that JM promotion was a piece of **** in execution and planning.  Hey, let's eliminate about 30-40% of the market by making it US only   Never mind the fact the packaging in Europe, Asia, Australia, New Zealand, Canada, Mexico and South America had the JM points   Lets make it an asinine ebay system that's bound to be abused by pissed off/excluded collectors and general malcontents

I'm just about the only person in Canada that got something out of this, thanks to DBK - at least I got a clone three pack in return for a bunch of points.  But really, how hard is this to execute?  Ask Playmates and the WOS line?  I managed to get those pretty easily, at least the ones I wanted.  Playmates was fine too when I emailed them.  They responded, apologized for not shipping outside the US but said no problem sending to a US addy that was not my own.  They wanted to make it obtainable.  And gosh, a couple of UPC's (not several hundred or more) got me two figures!   It worked for Cooder/Llewllyn and others as well.  It's not impossible, it's not hard.  Hasbro doesn't want to do it, the fan base isn't worth it to them

--"Nervous" about solid cases of anything, even clones.

Idiots.  How can you be so completely out of touch with your market?  Solid cases of 501st or Shock Troopers won't sell?  Idiots. 

They're not ******* around with us, lying to us, or misleading us in some black-ops misinformation campaign. They're not staging elaborate fake thefts for the benefit of me, some fan hanging around the booth. They're making and selling toys. They bring the toys to the Con to show them and have pictures taken of them, all in order to get the word out that new product will be available. Product they are selling and hope we will buy. They’re marketing their product.

This is Jared's quote from another thread.  I completely agree with the spirit in which this was written, so I'm not taking any issue with Jared here at all.  My point is simply that they aren't all that bright.  I witnessed it at C3.  Of the 6-7 guys on the panel, two (away from the microphones I might add) kept rolling their eyes and nodding their heads, pretty much in lock step with the audience at C3 - dominated by adult collectors. Guys like Colman asking about army builders, the Cloud Car, playsets.  But the answers that keep coming back talk about kids.  About Attacktix, about JediForce (already on clearance in Canada, newer waves not coming out) and all the other bull**** kids oriented line.  Does anyone here really think that the predominant market for Galactic Heroes is kids?  I'd heartily agree that lots of kids (2-10) and parents are indeed buying them, but that's not the case here.  The Falcon set in Canada retails for $50   Tell me some 3 year old is getting that? 

There are some spectacular things coming from Hasbro and it's unrealistic of us to expect to see everything we want.  I just get (excessively) frustrated by this bull**** they keep pumping out.  Treating people like idiots does win you any favors so why do they insist on doing that?  When you see lines clogging shelves (even unleashed around here where TRUs pegs are crammed with Dooku/Windu/Obi) you have to ask how can they be so out of touch.  I've said it before, but Hasbro really needs to come to grips with the concept that warehouse sales do not equal retail sales.  Pregnant Padme should have been hard to find, as should many of the other bit players (this includes Jedi with two minutes of screen time).  Clones, Vader should have been overpacked.  Vader should be the peg warmer because there were so many out there simply because someone will eventually pick him up.  What kid wants Bail Organa?

Ah, whatever.  I could go on for hours.  Blah, blah, ******* blah.

[CloneF13Y35]

I agree with you morgbug, either hasbro really doesn't know what the buying/collecting group, wants and is willing to BUY or they are totally ignoring us and just don't care. I have no interest personally in the unleashed line but I understand people who do. But why change it and drop it in favor of a miniature line???
How many people and how many times do we have to say we'd buy an acurrate mace windu lightsaber yet hasbro says it's a secondary character and they don't want to bother with it, yet they will produce the crappy mustafar playset, which no one I know has one OR wants one???
I'll just buy more white clones and paint them as I like.

[Nathan]

^ Agreed. "Secondary character" my eye. In TPM and AOTC he had more screen time than Palpatine.

[DoctorPadawan]

I've said this several times in the past, but it bears repeating:  In Hasbro's Minds, their motto is "WE DON'T MAKE MISTAKES."  They will never admit when they have made a poor decision, instead choosing to pass the blame onto either retailers or consumers.  Just once I'd like to hear them say, "Boy, the Epic Force line was destined to fail" or even "Attacktix just isn't as popular as we had hoped." 

If Hasbro were to actually take a step into an ACTUAL RETAIL STORE once in a while and not just rely on their field reps (who are about as easy to spot as Bigfoot) to feed them information, they might be able to see that, as Morgbug said, warehouse sales do not equal retail sales. 

Walk into just about any store on the east coast of the US (and possibly the rest of the country) and you'll see plenty of Attacktix of all styles (booster packs, starter sets, and Battle Masters) and Anakin and Obi-Wan Force Battlers.  Wal-Marts are choking on the second wave of Titanium Series, and Target is getting to be overrun with their Micro Series.  Basic figure pegs are populated by the same eight figures (SBD, Bail, Clone Pilot, Mas Amedda, Neimoidian, Wookiee Warrior, Grievous Bodyguard, and Tarfull) yet four of these figures are going to be rereleased as "new" figures and/or variations at a point in the line where the originals are so saturated, that a retail buyer is going to look in the case and say, "Oh ****, more Clone Pilots, stick this on a shelf in the back."

The Unleashed Obi-Wan and Anakin are sitting these days, sadly.  When combined, they are a cool display piece and despite my best efforts to convince non-UL collecting friends to pick a set up, they just won't bite.  Is that the fault of retail for ordering more?  Is it the fault of the consumer for not buying more?  Or is it the fault of Hasbro for overestimating demand for an item, not paying attention to the retail situation for said assortment, and continuing to ship the same amount of said item to retail despite the backlog?  I've had at least four different employees at my local Target (one of the rare good ones, it seems) to check and see if the Vader/Ventress/Sidious wave has arrived yet, and every time it's the same thing.  They have three cases of figures, all of which are packed full of Obi-Wans and Anakins.  All the Grievii are gone, since they restocked those figures when they run out, but Anakin and Obi-Wan remain.  But that's retail's fault, or it's our fault.

I'm actually in the minority here with the Unleashed line I guess, in that I was happy for several of the reissues since I started late and couldn't afford the high prices that a lot of them were commanding on the secondary market.  However, Hasbro either shipped too much or too little of an assortment, and when they shipped too much, they did so because they wouldn't change their case assortments to reflect the availability at retail.  The Vader rerelease only ever shipped at 2 per case, even after shipping for two months and mountains of Count Dookus and Mace Windus sitting on the pegs and the Vaders disappearing.  After the initial assortment, Vader should have been up to four per case, and maybe cycle some older figures in, like Fett or Yoda to fulfill demand.  Instead, we get more Dookus and Maces.  And don't even get me started on the mountain of Bossks and Securas my WM has.

And the problem with all this is that Hasbro won't admit that they made a poor decision.  When this Wedge business gets sorted out, do you think they'll say that they listened to fan commentary and that was why they went with the (somewhat) superior version we're now getting, or do you think they'll say that they had this planned all along and the 1997 Wedge pictured on every site prior to yesterday was a "prototype image?"  They'll pull the latter, because that's what they always do.

It's like they live in Bizarro World or something, where Attacktix, Force Battlers, the Micro Series, and the Titanium Series are all huge sellers and can't be kept in stock, the basic figure line sells only to children, vehicles are deader than a doornail and shouldn't be invested in, Jedi Force is burning up the sales charts, Unleashed is a flop, and Galactic Heroes appeal to primarily children. 

While I don't think that there is a huge black-ops operation going on (although their constant "if we told you we'd have to kill you" comments lead one to believe otherwise  ) and that they aren't being deliberately deceitful, I do think that there is a great deal of ego at Hasbro that doesn't want to admit that their decisions aren't the best ones for the line at times. 

[JediMAC]

I could go on for a bit here as well, but I'll refrain since it's late Friday afternoon, and my brain is already mush as it is, but regarding this...

It sounds like the modified TIE Fighter is on the way,

While I'd like to believe it will finally be to scale, I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest the word modified actually applies to the packaging, not the scale or the ship itself.

Several Hasbro reps have adamantly confirmed a new (revised) Tie Fighter to me (and many others) in person at 2004 SDCC, C3, and just last week at SDCC once again.  "New, accurately scaled wings" with the recent accurately sculpted cockpit.  So as much as I like harping on them too, there's no way this one's just going to be a packaging modification.  Unless the Hasbro guys are complete and total flat-out liars, which I don't think they are.

I see RS is saying it's going to be a Target exclusive.  So there ya' go.

But the rest of Brent's gripes still stand, of course. 

[bobafett14]

I'll disagrre about the Attacktix, my Kmart is empty (make that 2 Kmarts) and 2 Targets are wiped out sav e for one that has a good amount of starter kits.

Itill think it's going to be a sleeper line that will come back yrs. later.  Tioo many little nice things about the line

chrome base variations,
varying "rarities
playability
availability
variety
pricepoint
sculpts aren;t bad for the intentional slightly deformed look
the packaged tent sale figs.

There's a good bit to collect with this line, and the playability I think wll make the rarer ones even harder to find, I don;t know anyone who bought these that hasn;t played with them nicking them up a bit. ;^)

[CorranHorn]

The Clone answer, as I read/understood it, is saying "We only have the capacity to produce so many Clones.  Since we're trying to put out colored CLones and whites, we're using both toolings of the Clone". 

So I'm not sure everyone's reading that as I did, but I think that's the case...  Perhaps not a run-around answer so much, but not answered very articulately (articulate...  articulation...  hah, I slay me), or at least not straight to the point what with just coming out and saying "We're not able to meet demand right now using just the SA Clone's sculpt, we gotta use both of them to do that".

That, actually, makes sense...  And they don't wanna tool a new mold I'm sure, that'd be a hefty investment for relatively short-term gain since supply/demand will balance itself as it inevitably does.

Jesse, are you saying that since they have so many Clones to make, they are already utilizing all of their available SA Clone molds and as such they have to use the #6 Clone molds to meet the demand for the variety of Clones? While that does make a bit of sense, it just seems foolish to not just wait until they've gone through the run of one figure, before going onto the next utilizing the same mold. Or hell just make new molds, at this point is the reproduction of an already produced mold that costly in terms of time and dollars?

Here's something I've noticed, that I haven't seen many people pick on, but then again I've not been paying a lot of attention lately. Has anyone noticed Hasbro's huge dive into the "micro" or "mini" world of toys? First it was Galactic Heroes, which is more of a toddler's toy so that's ok.. But then we have the Wizards RPG figures. Then there is Titanium which is getting it's own figure sets soon. Then there's Attackix, which while it has a gimmick is still a micro toy. Now there's the upcoming Unleashed mini line. That's 5 different toy lines which fall well under the 3.75" scale. Why is so much attention being paid to these pint-sized toys? Couldn't the 2" Unleashed figures be marketed for the Wizards RPG line instead? Couldn't those figures then be a part of the Titanium line? Why so much waste, we're going to wind up seeing the sam figures made for 3 different lines, when one figure could have been made to cover all the bases. It just boggles the mind...

[Nathan]

^ Many of us have been griping for years about the cancellation of the MicroMachines and particularly Action Fleet series. I think all this mini stuff is some sort of twisted attempt to fill that market niche and shut us up.

But why not bring the stuff back properly, under the MM and AF fleet banners, instead of this scattershot method? Maybe it falls under the "never admitting they're wrong" thing, where bringing back MM and AF could be seen as caving to collector demands.

But even if that's the case, why the duplication of effort (Micro Vehicles & Titanium vehicles, Attacktix & Mini Unleashed, etc.)? Could be the "throw enough crap at the wall and see what sticks" cover-all-your-bases approach. Though you'd think they'd be better off concentrating efforts on one thing or the other.

I don't get it either.

[Morgbug]

Several Hasbro reps have adamantly confirmed a new (revised) Tie Fighter to me (and many others) in person at 2004 SDCC, C3, and just last week at SDCC once again.  "New, accurately scaled wings" with the recent accurately sculpted cockpit.  So as much as I like harping on them too, there's no way this one's just going to be a packaging modification.  Unless the Hasbro guys are complete and total flat-out liars, which I don't think they are.

Matt, I recall the conversation with Hasbro at C3.  I still think they'll **** it up.  I don't think it's lying intentionally, I just think they don't get it. 

It's like dealing with the EPA.  They say they're working on something and then do something completely different.  They did exactly what they understood that they said it just happens to have a different interpretation from their side of the room. 

I believe you.  I believe they believe they're going to put out the right thing.  I believe they'll **** it up.  That's all.

[CorranHorn]

^ Many of us have been griping for years about the cancellation of the MicroMachines and particularly Action Fleet series. I think all this mini stuff is some sort of twisted attempt to fill that market niche and shut us up.

But why not bring the stuff back properly, under the MM and AF fleet banners, instead of this scattershot method? Maybe it falls under the "never admitting they're wrong" thing, where bringing back MM and AF could be seen as caving to collector demands.

But even if that's the case, why the duplication of effort (Micro Vehicles & Titanium vehicles, Attacktix & Mini Unleashed, etc.)? Could be the "throw enough crap at the wall and see what sticks" cover-all-your-bases approach. Though you'd think they'd be better off concentrating efforts on one thing or the other.

I don't get it either.

ya know I had completely forgotten about the Target micro line, that's another thing to throw into the pot. I think this year has been most definitely a throw the crap at the wall and see what sticks approach. look at all the new lines and sub-lines they're debuting in 2005...

Attackix
Unleashed 2"
Titanium
Target's Micro line
Force Battlers
Potato Heads
Evolutions (figure sub line)
Battle Packs (figure sub line)
Battle Sets (figure sub line - whatever the Dooku vs Anakin set is called)

and that's just off the top of my head. and even further, they have no long term plans to continue any of the figure sub lines, nor do they realize how oversaturated the market is on some of the other lines. which is par for the course, because the stuff they have no long term plans for are going to be the things that sell and the stuff they focus on will warm shelves and stockrooms for months...

[Nathan]

^ Plus the M&Ms.

[Jesse James]

Jason,

Yeah, that's what I was saying, but I agree it's partly not a good idea...  And (hah, who'd have thought this would happen) to Hasbro's defense somewhat, they ARE adamantly saying they're trying to meet the HUGE outcry for Clone figures...

TE Gunners mixing into new cases (3 per case I think?), the 501st battlepack, 501st SA figure, etc., etc...  Plus the Hasbro chap made a point in Mike's interview to say "plus we're also trying to put out White Clones since people want white ones too" (or whatever he said)...

I can see it.  Like you said, it does make sense, but I agree that they're maybe over-compensating perhaps.  I dunno if new molds is the answer or not.  If production abilities are that low, maybe that's what the situation warrants.  I mean, once you get to a certain point with any item you create and put into production, if you sell enough of it you eventually weed its costs down to the minimal costs of production and the margin of profit on your product only grows to your advantage... 

I'm 100% certain the Clone figures are items like this.  The same happens for other toy lines.  For instance, 21st Century Toys produces its 1:18 airplanes based on popularity of the plane in our culture, overall size, and how much it can be repainted and put back out.  The plane has to be able to be repainted to "pay for itself" basically...  You can only sell so many of a D-Day Spitfire, but you can repaint it and sell it again as a Czech Spitfire, a lend-loan spitfire, a Battle of Britain spitfire, a Pacific Spitfire, etc., etc., etc...

Eventually, the start-up costs are widdled down to nothing, or where you wanted them anyway, and you only have small costs to manufacture the item being a factor...

Clones (and many figures in the line) work similarly.  Clones are the best example though, because you release them as white only and I bet they pay for themselves several times over...  You release repaints and you're looking at an almost pure profit item.

The question I thought had the biggest bull**** answer to it in the Q&A, and the one that irked me, was "we're afraid of solid cases of Clones".  Solid cases of figures are a gamble, but for them to not "get" that solid Clone cases would sell is just stupid... 

To Hasbro's defense on that issue, don't put out a solid case, but pack it pretty damn close...  Or how about 3 TE Gunners, 3 501st, 3 Shocktroopers, and a mix of Commanders (1 bacara, 1 green, 1 red).

It's not a solid case of any one figure, but it'd fill a void, it'd make people happy about this "Solid Clone Case" issue they're so reluctant to do, and everyone would win.

[Darby]

I don't know as much about all this as Jesse and some of the others, but I find it odd Hasbro would be limited somehow in the number of Clones they could get out of one body.  Playmates certainly never had this problem with their Star Trek lines - several figures utilized the same body, often in the same assortment - and Hasbro has already shipped multiple paint variants of the same figure simultaneously: the EP1 Battle Droid.

I would think solid cases of clones would sell like toliet paper - it always sells - provided there was variety in the paint schemes.  A case of #41 clones done up in 501st, Utapau, and Shocktrooper colors would never go out of style.

[DoctorPadawan]

On the Clone issue, has anyone else noticed that the #41 Clone and the CW Clone are different sculpts in most areas?  They've already done a ROTS style Clone head for the Target Clone, so why not put that sculpt to use, alongside the #41 Clone and the #6 Clone if they are that strapped for molds?  Just a thought...

And for the rest of my post I'm going to pull a rabbit out of my hat.  Or comment on Corran's list.  Probably the latter.   

Attackix

Failure.  It might move in some areas, but it's bombing everywhere I go. 

Unleashed 2"

Destined to fail.  The figure sculpts don't have near the detail as the 7" line, and they look like less cartoony Attacktix.

Titanium

Bombing badly.  Every WM I go into has an endcap *and* a section in the SW aisle, not to mention a small section in the die cast aisle crammed full of the 04/02/05 assortment.  And Hasbro decides to get all the other retailers in on the disaster in the new year. 

Target's Micro line

Not selling at all, hardly.  The only thing I ever see move from these toys is (surprisingly) the Invisible Hand.  And since Hasbro's already said this last ROTS assortment and the Turbo Tank is it for now, at least they're paying some attention.

Force Battlers

Complete and unmitigated disaster.  Vader sold, as did Grievous after a long while, but Anakin and Obi-Wan are permanent fixtures on the pegs at this point, and in great numbers.  But try getting Hasbro to admit the line is dying.

Potato Heads

Every Wal-Mart I go to is sitting on at least 60 of these.  Target and K-Mart, while less clogged, have them sitting in the same position and in the same numbers every time I go in.  Not a success at all, IMO.

Evolutions (figure sub line)

Although it's still too early to tell, I think this line is going to do very well.  The Anakin set seems to be getting almost universal praise, the Clone set is highly anticipated (and will be a massive headache to find, I'm afraid) and the Sith set is giving us Ultimate versions of the three non-Vader Sith Lords.  If they don't overship Anakin, and they ship the Clones in ridiculous numbers, this is going to probably be the best side line in the line's history, IMO.

Battle Packs (figure sub line)

Well, the Sith vs. Jedi set has only shown up at my local K-Mart and the same four sets have been sitting on the shelf for the last week or so.  I ran into a kid in the aisle the other day (BUYING A CLONE TROOPER; YOU HEAR THAT HASBRO?) and he was looking at it, saying, "Who is this supposed to be?" (referring to Anakin).  When I told him, he laughed and said, "Really?  That's stupid!" 

As for how the line will do, I think the first set will do well once it gets out there, but the OT set is going to bomb, the Hoth set will bomb, the Separatist set will bomb, and the 501st set will fly off the shelves.

Battle Sets (figure sub line - whatever the Dooku vs Anakin set is called)

These would be the Battle Arenas.  While I didn't hate them like a lot of people, they were definitely overpriced by about five bucks, and depending on where you lived, definitely overshipped.  After the first case or two (which is usually when people in my area have gotten theirs for the collections), the sets started to sit, particularly Mace vs. Palpatine for some reason (I thought it was the best of the three).  As this was a "limited" assortment (as in it wasn't going to be ongoing, not as in it was produced in limited quantities), I don't think it's going to be a problem in the long run because they can do a clearance on the whole SKU and be done with it.

And you forgot one, Corran...Jedi Force.  The line which was DOA unless you were more machine than man, and even he has become a pegwarmer in my parts.  When Yoda and/or Vader are pegwarmers in ANY line, you know you've got a problem.  Target doesn't even have them in the same aisle as the SW action figures, and the Luke/Speeder Bikes are taking up space in the Clearance aisle already, even at 6.99 apiece.

And I'd just like to say that the "Hasbro was caught off guard" crap is getting old in regards to certain lines.  Since its release under the GH banner, the GH figures have sold consistently well and there is no way that the success of the line caught Hasbro off guard.  Up until ROTS, I had never seen one of the two packs sit for more than a week, and they were constantly restocked.  The Falcon and the X-Wing are sitting though, but the figure packs move and move quickly (even the initial ROTS sets are starting to move now).