Army Building or Hoarding?

[CHEWIE]

Wow, the number of Cody figures on ebay is sick - just sick.

 

[Spectre]

But what I've learned is that in the end, one way or the other, you'll get your figures.

That's exactly how I feel about it. Having patience pays off in the end almost 100% of the time.

If you are the type of collector that feels they "must" have every new figure and in the quantities they would like the second that the figures hit the pegs, and you have the resources to do so, more power to you. I hold no ill will towards anyone else in the collecting world.

I, on the other hand, do not have alot of disposable income/free time to buy everything in the quantities that I want, but I do have something that alot of collectors do not- patience.

For Example:

I had been missing 4 Saga (2002-2004) figures for quite some time (McQuarrie Concept Stormtrooper, Ayy Vida, Walmart Cantina Set Momaw Nadon, and the blond Imperial Officer). While aside from the rather lackluster Concept Stormie, none of these figures are actually "hard to find" or "desirable", these basic figures never showed up in my area in any kind of decent numbers. Then take the Cantina Sets (I just wanted Nadon as he was the only figure to have new parts that actually looked decent, I eventually ended up with a couple of Ponda Babas from the K-Mart Sets and the Greedo is identical to another release so I really don't care about him), there was only 1 Walmart in all of North NJ when the Cantina Sets hit and they stocked 1 case which ended up in the hands of a disgustiongly dirty known scalper who had them on his table at the Wayne Toy Show the following weekend marked up to $24 each  Needless to say, I never found any of the above at retail and I refused to pay e-bay prices or outragous shipping from etailers. I just aquired 2 of the 4 figures (1 Concept Stormie, and Ayy Vida- in multiples no less!) last summer in trades I did with members here and on other boards. I finally got my Cantina Momaw Nadon last week in a trade with someone over at JoeCustoms. I still need at least 1 blond Imperial Officer, which I'm confident I'll get eventually. Total cost for me on these figures- some random pieces from my Swap Shop and the cost of shipping them to my trading partners. Total headache involved in aquiring said figures- none


Here's an example of army building patience:

I've been planning an Imperial Garrison diorama for about 8 years that I plan on getting around to building in the near future and really would like to have about 2 dozen Deathstar Troopers for it. At the time of his initial release, it was impossible to find even 1 of them in my neck of the woods. Through trades (strangly, mostly from European sources) I was able to aquire about 5 or 6 of them, far short of my goal, but a start none the less. I have recently aquired a few more in trades (the exact number is unknown at this point due to everything still being packed up from the move) but I'm sure the number has not yet reached even the first dozen I would like. Am I disappointed, I must admit that I may be, slightly, but I know that my collecting (and my dioramas/displays) are an ongoing, constantly evolving thing. If I don't have my full 2 dozen by the time my diorama is built, I'll just leave the spaces for them open and fill them in as I get more. No harm, no foul. I collect for myself, not to show off to anyone else

Another army building example:

Even though my dislike for all things Clone-related is well known in the customizing community, I would actually like some Scorch figures. Not to make Delta Squad as is most people's reasons for aquiring multiples of this "hard to find figure" (well, right behind ripping people off on ebay anyway ), but because I always grab a quartet (or better) of any new armored trooper/character that comes out for customizing purposes. I happen to feel that a repainted/modded Scortch with a different head/helmet/accessories would make an awsome armored Merc squad, or Bounty Hunters, or just about anything. Just imagine a customized Scortch body with a "Halo" Master Chief head- how cool would that be? I have yet to see a single Scortch that is not in the hands or on the show table of our local scalper scum, but I'm not dismayed because I know that eventually I'll get my 3 or 4, even if it's years down the road and there's no "deadline" on making customs

[Fritzkrieg]

First of all, How my comments about some Collectors being whiny and Lazy, could ever be considered more offensive than some others comments of Army Building being a form of mental Illness, is beyond me.The rant at the end of my post was a defensive response to those Comments and I do not apologise for defending myself and other Army Builders w/ Vigor. Although the Cursing was Wrong and for that I do Apologise. I do not think that the Collection of 95 UT Clones was aquired through standard retail collecting avenues, It would be highly improbable to aquire that many UT Clones in such a short amount of time. So, this guy most likely paid a higher price than most of us would for his Army. If he has the resources to do it let him. It is a free Country after all .  I personally have a very good territory  for my Collecting needs, I aquire most of my Army Builders from 4 or 5 Retail Stores that are on my route to and from the Office. So, my collecting Does not cut into my real life as much as some. It just requires, not hitting the Snooze Button more than once. I live in a Major  Metropolitan  part of South FL and their are Dozens of other Retail Stores for other Collectors to have at that I do not frequent regulary. My Collection did not magically apear over night, I began Collecting Star Wars again in 1995, so my Collection of 250 Stormtroopers was aquired over 11 Years. Thats 4,015 Days, which means I've aquired .062 of my Stromtrooper collection every Day over the Last 11 Years. A lot of that was aquired through Trades (Helping the Star Wars Community). I've been a member of the Star Wars Trade Fedration since 2000, and have helped many of my fellow collectors get Hard to find Figures. At one point I was Trading the Lego Republic Gunships for 10 Sneak Preview Troopers, If thats not helping other Collectors out I don't know what is. A lot of other collectors feel that army Builders hurt the Hobby, But if you took the Army Builders out of the Hobby do you think Hasbro would be so commited to making Star Wars Figures. Every Army Builder leaves a much larger imprint on the action figure  Market than a regular Collector, I personally feel that I leave a Market Imprint of at leats 10 Normal Collectors or Kids. If you take that Imprint and those of every other Army Builder out of the Market How long do you think Hasbro will feel that the Star Wars Brand is a Viable License. I would put Money on the fact that the Utapau Clone will see the Largest Realease of any of the figures released this year, Because of Arny Builders like myself. Now on the Defensive again, I have a very full Life, a little to full if you ask my friends and Family. I have a Wonderful Wife ( She lets me have My Own Star Wars Room too) and 2 Boys (Spaz & Stitch), whom I put above my Collecting Always! I wake up every Mornig at   5 AM to go for a Run or go to the Gym.  I Compete in Triathlons Durring the Spring and summer Months. I'm a Regional Manager of an Optical Chain, which takes up about 60 Hrs of my time a week. I also have a Small Ebay Buisness that I run. (No Scalping!!!!). My point is that I feel these attacks on Army Builders are out of jealousy and not of any logical reasoning. Army Building is good for the Hobby. Look at the Products we have recieved because of Army Building. The Entertainment Earth Clone Trooper 4 Packs, Clone Army 3 Packs from the Clone Wars and Revenge of the Sith, Comtech and Sand trooper army Buider 4 Packs, The Target Clone Troopers and Coruscant Attack Multipack, And We've Got a Great Set of ARC Troopers from the Clone Wars Series comming Up.

Long Live the GAR!

Fritzkrieg

[CHEWIE]

Good post Fritz, and long live the Army Building.   

Your kids got to love your collection.

 

[Clone Commander]

And the world goes back to normal. 

[Gatillo]

Unfortunately people will always attack army builders.  Some jockstrap almost took some figures from my wife's shopping cart because she had 3 U clones in there for me this past weekend.  She had to yell at the guy.  He said he only wanted one.  The funny thing is that my wife would have given one to him if he had asked before dipping his hands in the cart (if you are the guy and you are reading this, well, that's life dude ).

I totally agree that the early bird should get the worm.  I do not go to Target at 8 for my health or to WM at 7 for coffee.

I think people tend to be more frazzled in non-movie years when figures start to hit and they cannot find them.  Our hobby lacks the patience that others have. 

Just like the #41 ROTS clone, U clones will eventually be in the pegs (because all of the assortments they continue to ship in) and people will pass them over.  I see AT-AT drivers in the pegs all the time now as opposed to a month ago.

[Reid]

Army Building is good for the Hobby. Look at the Products we have recieved because of Army Building. The Entertainment Earth Clone Trooper 4 Packs, Clone Army 3 Packs from the Clone Wars and Revenge of the Sith, Comtech and Sand trooper army Buider 4 Packs, The Target Clone Troopers and Coruscant Attack Multipack, And We've Got a Great Set of ARC Troopers from the Clone Wars Series comming Up.

Long Live the GAR!

Fritzkrieg

I highly doubt that greedy hoarders are the cause of the Army Builder multipacks that are, have been, and are coming out.

[CHEWIE]

I'd say that army-building is the prime reason of such multi-packs coming out... what other reason is there?  Maybe not because of the hoarders, but definitely because of army-builders.

Everyone should be able to get along in this thread, stop calling army-builder "hoarders" and nobody should call the people complaining "whiners" either. 

For what it's worth, I bought two more orange Clones today.  Opened them both and they are sitting on my monitor at work watching me type this.

 

[Gatillo]

Chewie that is not a good idea.  U clones are not to be trusted.

[Jesse James]

I wish all those things tied to army building were "good" though. 

$15 Clone repaints, overpriced individual EE packs and the like are a plague...  In all honesty I look at the EE packs as something focused on the collecting mentality overall at first...  The intent that they get to army builders was negated by the packaging and price.  I see very few large SA Clone Wars Clone armies as a result...  Lower the price on individual sets, like the CT Stormtrooper and Sandtrooper sets were priced, and that's good army building IMO... 

I wish I'd been able to buy up the CW Clone sets at a good price but I had to settle...  A big bummer.   

[Dan]

Another deterrent to army building is Hasbro's new love of dirt and wear on figures. That might be fine as a variant, but having a clean version first seems the way to go. I now have 3 UT clones, and look at them thinking I don't want any more because of the paint apps. It makes sense that there would be more than one clean trooper in any given diorama, but 95 guys all with the same "wear" and "damage"? It just doesn't look right.

GIVE US CLEAN STORMTROOPERS, SANDTROOPERS, CLONES, BATTLE DROIDS, BIKERSCOUTS AND SNOWTROOPERS.  And package them in paper bags with marker saying what they are, so they can be priced reasonably.

[Clone Commander]

I cant say I like the idea of a paper bag but I would love to see a clean utapau trooper.
But then again what are ya' gonna do?   
I can live with the weathering.

[darthmac]

I do modest army building.  My largest collecting of the 'same' figure is the POTJ Rebel trooper which I got 9 in one ebay auction (I'm actually looking to catch & release 3 of these guys).  But beyond that I really don't have more than about 4 of the same figure, together they form a nice little army. 

Yes troopers look better displayed when in groups just a c3-po looks better when displayed next to r2-d2.  But having 90+ identical figures just sitting on a shelf is hording.  If your going to put together an army, at least display it in an interesting way.  If you want a picture of 100+ troopers lined up in an identical pose, use photoshop and save yourself several hundred dollars.  To me a good army buildling limit is 10, unless you have a specific display need the demands more.

I really think all this boiling anger over hoarding, army building and scapling right now comes from the fact that most of us can not find much of any figures, little lone the ones we are looking for.  I would say in my last 10 runs I have found only 1 store that had more then 1 figure.  Right now there is a major disconnect between hasbro and collector demand and this anger will only get worse until they find a way of letting collectors get the figures they want.  I also believe Hasbro is turning people off from buying their product if no one (collectors and kids) can ever get the figures they want - and that should be a concern to their stock holders.

[Darth Slothus]

Right now there is a major disconnect between hasbro and collector demand and this anger will only get worse until they find a way of letting collectors get the figures they want.  I also believe Hasbro is turning people off from buying their product if no one (collectors and kids) can ever get the figures they want - and that should be a concern to their stock holders.

I totally disagree with this. Hasbro must be making a good product to have demand so high as it is now. Unfortunately, Retailers are at fault for not meeting current demands/not Hasbro. Retailers unfortunately read into future demands this year to be low. While even I will admit I figured after the movie euphoria lowered that demand would go down and thus we would see less product this year. Unfortunately, there's a new market for Sw again(the last movie recruited alot of new/young buyers)=demand is through the roof. Please don't tell me BS about hasbro having/setting limits at retailers for shelf space either. This is a contract between both the retailer AND hasbro..not just Hasbro get s all the say. Hasbro is simply shipping out quantities to retailers wherehouses as per how much the retailer asks for. I don't think Hasbro's at fault here..if folks want to talk case assortments, now that's a bird of a different feather and I would go after Hasbro on that.

Hasbro obviously had alot on the table for 06' and arguably so considering the majority of their profit last year helped by SW toys. Sadly, in the end, when they presented their 2006 plan to retail, it was the retailers who said "yeah, that looks ok but, we only want this much of it in 2006" or something to that effect (speculation:judging by how I've seen them handle the consumers demand). I look at just how much hasbro IS offering this year for SW then I look at how MUCH I see of it in the store or definately the frequency of it and that's why I hold the blame retailers position.

Well that's MY position on why we're screwed.   

[darthmac]

By disconnet I mean lots of us wanting to buy figures and store shelves being empty.  Somewhere between hasbro and us something is broken (be that the retailers or whoever).  Is there another retail item where the items fly off the shelves instantly then the stores are afraid to restock it?  I've taken a few economics courses in my time, and this just befuddles me.  I know nothing about Hasbro's strategy or so called limits.  But my guess is they want to sell as much product as possible.

As for the selection Hasbro is offering this year, I have been really happy, I would just like to find some of it.

I just can't understand why their own website does not allow backordering/pre-ordering of figures.  Their own store should be able to eliminate this supply disconnect, but instead they run it like any other retailer blindly ordering stock like it comes from some other company.

I do stand by my belief that if this supply problem continues that 'some' folks will begin to lose interest.